Audible: So What Do You Think?
Radio City Music Hall: via Associated Press
1: Darrelle Revis, CB Pittsburgh
2: David Harris, LB Michigan
6: Jacob Bender, OT Nicholls State
7: Chansi Stuckey, WR Clemson
I don’t have the time to do my full draft analysis until later, but let us know what you thought about the Jets’ draft. Did you like it? Hate it? Just okay? Why? Here’s some quick thoughts until I can take time to pull some more solid stuff together:
- The Front Office has been selling it to anyone who will listen, but I do count Thomas Jones as part of this draft class.
- I like their picks, (2 early contributors, 2 developmental) but I would like to see what they could have drafted had they kept their picks (since the Thomas Jones trade).
- They were serious about the “21 of 22″ starters thing, with their free agent work, and their few draft picks, they must feel like they have a good team in place.
33 Responses to Audible: So What Do You Think?
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TOON says:
As with any Draft, you really cannot tell until a few years down the road – unless the top 2 picks become busts or stars right away.
One thing I like is staying on the path that EM/MT developed last year – picking quality PEOPLE who are also very good football players.
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Adam says:
This year it definitely made sense (based on the depth of the draft) to be willing to trade up – they got 2 players who should start or at least play significant time – To be honest, Revis should start, nothing they have is as good as him as evidenced by the inability of any of them to hold down the job last year.
Maybe this helps inspire Justin Miller to work a little harder and become a better CB – Dyson is not a spring chicken – he probably has 1 or 2 good years left as the #2 CB…
Harris seems from all I read to be a steal/solid pick and quite honestly I’m happy and excited by the draft class (must be an elite school with class sizes this small).
Well the Pats have taken over the on paper championship from the Redskins – maybe that bodes well for the Jets. They had an average draft though the Moss thing helps. They seem to agree with the Jets FO that this year was week cause they traded out of it.
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GlockNSoul says:
While I am excited about the 4 picks – even the late ones seem exciting, I’m concerned that we only have 4 picks. For all the talk of wanting to build your core through the draft, 4 players year won’t build a significant roster. Hopefully, this was a one-year strategy. While I believe Revis and Harris will be quality players, when you look back on the draft, you can be guaranteed that you’ll find players nearly as good (or better) drafted in rounds 3-4.
I hope we do well in the UFA market, as well as with veteran releases in training camp given our cap surplus.
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jeff i says:
“I do not count T Jones as part of this class. At the time of the trade they bragged about keeping all their picks, so it is inconsistant to now turn around and say otherwise.”
Who cares what they said at the time they made the trade. The bottom line is they gave up draft value this year for Jones. No matter how they spun it at the time, or you slice it now, they traded an ’07 draft pick for an ’07 draft pick and got a player in return. That player should be counted as part of the draft. To suggest otherwise is illogical.
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Ferragamo says:
I’m really can’t complain about the Jets 07 draft. This years class was not very strong, especially after the second round so I don’t mind that the Jets took quality over quanity. The fact that we got two of the best defensive players in the entire draft is huge. It looks even better because Harris was coveted by the Patriots and was projected to go in the first round and he fell to us. What’s the sense of having a ton of draft picks if half the players are going to get cut anyway. I guarantee a lot of these players drafted won’t even make there teams.
I like the two late round picks becuase Stuckey may be able to develop into a solid slot receiver, before his foot injury he was projected as a 2nd to 4th rounder. Bender is a project, but just look at the way he handled Adam Carriker and you’ll see his potential, it sounds like he’s coming in with a chip on his shoulder too.
I still would have liked a nice big nose tackle like the kid out of Utah that went to the Dolphins, but hey you can’t get them all.
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First I don’t count Thomas as a draft pick, especially since he’s nearly 30 years old.
Second, I’m upset that they wasted a lot of picks at moving up when they have so many needs. We had the worst run defense in the league last year ( http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef.php ), so that should have been a priority at multiple spots. We still haven’t addressed our DT issue properly.
Third what happens if either Revis or Harris don’t pan out? This was an all our eggs in one basket thinking, and I’m not fond of that strategy during the draft. It seems that teams that move down usually do better (think Ricky Williams, Eli Manning [both moving up] vs. The Jimmy Johnson Cowboys).
If we had stayed with our picks we might have had a draft like:
1. Ross/Houston DB
2. Buster Davis ILB, Usama Young, DB
2. Alford/Tank Thomas, DT
3. Okwo ILB, D. Hughes DB
5. Tim Shaw ILD, Landri DTWhich gives us much more depth (less risk) at 3 spots.
In essence, Mangini went against the norm, and for it to be the right decision, both these guys need to work out.
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Harlan Lachman says:
” they must feel like they have a good team in place.”
This is the key statement in your article.
The draft was great. How can you not like two of the best players at their positions which coincide with our positions of need when we were picking in the bottom 22% of all teams.
My concerns are the failure to deal with OL weakness in FA and the commitment to DeWayne and Vilma.
To have ten mil in the bank and still have non performers like Barrett and McYawn on the team means we could have afforded the best OL signed in FA. Moore and Clement (or Bender or a young guy) had better perform well enough to keep Chad standing and throwing longer than dinks and TJ running through holes.
And Vilma and DeWayne better have near pro bowl years. Vilma was apparently high in demand. DeWayne much less so. But in FA and the draft we made no move to replace or trade them Another off year will diminish whatever value they have.
As an old and long time Jet fan, I sure hope Tangini are correct and we do have a pretty good team in place, especially on the OL and with Vilma and DeWayne.
h
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I think it’s impossible to gauge a draft on the day after — you have to give it 3-5 years because some players take longer to get to the field (Cotchery, Coles and Pennington, for example).
That being said, I really like the guys we got, but like a few others, at first I wished we had gotten a few more of them. But then I started thinking about it, and really, what are we talking about? A normal draft would net us 7 draftees and 10-15 undrafted free agents. Instead, we got 4 draftees and will sign 10-15 undrafted free agents — a difference of 3 guys. I don’t think that’s gonna make or break the team in the grand scheme of things (I hope).
I know I’m repeating myself, but I do like the way the team is being built — last year, they needed a LT and C, and got the #1-rated guys at both spots. This year, they needed a CB and ILB, and got the #1-rated guy (Revis) and another guy that was pretty close to the top. If they play to form, the team is better today than it was last Friday.
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Nikolas says:
I do not understand the people who talk about quantity of picks, they seem
to think as if the Jets are in a rebuilding mode. This team won 10 games last
year with a QB recovering from injury, new offensive and defensive systems
two young and a FA O-Linemen and with no running game. Forget this.
The QB is healthy again, the offensive and defensive systems are not new,
the offensive line is intact and more experienced, and the running game seems
to be more than promising with Leo and TJ. This team, without any draft picks
is already solid. So , I do agree with the Tangini approach, because if Revis and Harris start in their respective positions, this will be not just a good team, but one of the most solid teams in the NFL. They would have the same chance as anyone else for a
Superbowl.more than just
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Ilan says:
I like this draft. I hea a lot of people talking about the number of holes the Jets have and how they weren’t filled. About the only concern I have is at the OLB spot. Revis and Harris should be long-time starters in this 3-4 defense and alone will drastically improve the play against the run. Robertson is probably an above average nose tackle and contrary to popular belief did not get pushed around the second half of ’06. Very few DE available in the draft would displace Coleman or Ellis and don’t forget we also have Michael Haynes who was a failure in the 4-3 but I believe will become a productive player in a two-gap scheme and behind him two veterans in KVO and Hamilton.
The only area that wasn’t adressed that I would have liked to see was the red zone offense. I think it will get better on the basis of the o-line having a year under their belts and the addition of Jones, but Cotchery and Coles are not red zone receivers and Moore and Clement were not effective road graders last year.
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“I do not understand the people who talk about quantity of picks, they seem to think as if the Jets are in a rebuilding mode. This team won 10 games last year with a QB recovering from injury…”
We won 4 games the year before, and were on an easier schedule. Additionally our QB was healthy for the entire season, which knowing Chad’s history isn’t a sure thing for 2007. In fact I’d go as far as saying last year was a lucky year in terms of health. We got 16 games from Pennington, Leon Washington, 4 WRs and 3 TEs. I doubt that the same will happen again this year.
Remember this year we’re going to have a tougher schedule and face other teams that have also improved this offseason.
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SackDance99 says:
Let’s start off with the proposition that this was a very weak draft. The Jets saw that and decided to get the top guys at what they believed were the 2 biggest “need” positions, CB and ILB. Mangini/Tannenbaum were decisive and bold. So, while I liked other players and positions. You have to give the Jets credit for identifying needs and executing a strategy to fill those needs. And, we got 2 pretty good football players (I wanted Grubbs and Jarrett, but focusing on defense made sense, too). While I still think that the Jets need a real run-stopping RDE, there were only 3 guys who fit that description, Okoye, Carriker and Harrell and they were all gone by the 16th pick and the Jets probably thought that Coleman was better than any of them. Bottom line is that the Jets defense has more talent than last season, the offense has a premier RB and we’ll just have to hope there are training camp cuts to provide depth at RG/RT (Bender is a project and it’s a lot to expect any UDFA to be a solid OL back up). And, the Jets still need TE depth, if Baker goes down, who is our pass-catching TE? I rate the draft a solid B.
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Sean says:
I think the way the draft played out more than validated the approach that Tannenbaum took. This draft was weak at the top, strong between 11-50, and then it abruptly dropped off a cliff. Guys who I was targeting with the 25th pick were long gone by the time it actually rolled around, and guys who I had targeted in the third round were off the board by the middle of the second. That’s the kind of draft it was.
When all the corners were being talked up, my feeling was that the Jets would avoid the position unless there was one player who they felt was clearly superior to the others. As it turns out, they clearly had a preference, and they went up and took the first one off the board. I’ve got no problems with moving around to take the best player at the proper spot in the draft, and Revis was coming off the board with the next selection. I’d much rather move up for Revis than stay put and be stuck with Chris Houston. By all accounts he was a stud at Pitt, and he played long enough to put together a substantial body of work. The team also got terrific value at the spot where they took Harris. He projects into our defense as well as any defensive prospect in the draft. So the Jets added two starters with their four picks, just as they added two starters with their 10 picks last year. Teams can’t afford to add so few bodies to their rosters season after season, but with the team being very active at depth enhancement during free agency and with their having had a strong and deep draft class last year, this was a reasonable approach.
There are two potential stumbling blocks to this draft. The first is that Alan Branch becomes a stud. Branch was the only elite player with the frame to play the nose in the 3-4, and the run defense was a more pressing issue than the pass defense last season. If Branch is terrific and the run defense continues to struggle, perhaps the FO will take some flack. Still, that’s poor thinking- the reality is that elite corners are far more difficult to find than 2-down DTs, so the Revis pick was the correct one regardless of Branch’s availability. The second issue is that the team’s depth might suffer from the poor haul. It’s a reasonable concern, but I think they are actually deeper than they are given credit for. The quarterbacks are set 1 through 3, the running back group is now pretty robust, the team added a bunch of players to augment the depth in the front seven, and the secondary is now well stocked. The team needed a #1 corner, but now everyone can slide to their proper positions, with Miller taking the slot and Dyson/Poteat manning the outside.
Does this draft mean the team will catch New England? No. But that was an unrealistic goal- the Jets are still 1-2 years out from having a roster ready to seriously contend for a championship. But they added solid pieces this offseason, and that’s about all you can ask for.
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Alan Branch of the 23 senior season tackles. Smells too much like Gabe Watson for me. I prefer Robertson. Think he’s a better player too. Remember, Sione Pouha will be back from injury this year. Last year in training camp he projected as the back-up NT. Still have Rashad Moore (marginal player but provides depth) and C. J. Moseley. I’d say the Jets are set with defensive line depth. I’m more concerned about the pass rush.
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On the quantity vs quality debate, here’s one thing to keep in mind: In today’s free agency era, you may only have a player for three years. If you’re only replacing 4 players per year of that pipeline, you can run dry pretty quickly. Again, I hope this was a one-year strategy, and I do believe it was.
Frustrating thing is, now matter how well we do, Patriots just seem to get even better. Two first round picks next year already (hope the 49ers make the Super Bowl). Can only hope Moss keeps acting like TO and becomes a distraction.
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wink69 says:
The Jets need to concentrate on being successful in their own division first, and we lost ground to NE in this year’s draft/FA period. I like the picks, and T. Jones is a steal, but a high profile LB (Thomas) and elite DE would have really helped shore up a D that could be facing the Patsies 3x again this year. I agree that the pass rush is our biggest concern. I think the Jets were willing to trade up to try and grab the top 3-4 DE Carriker, but he climbed the board higher than they hoped and could not find a partner. Plan B was Revis who will undoubtedly help. If Harris lives up to his billing, he will be the run stuffer they have been missing in the middle. No question our guys looked at all other options here (including Branch) and had him at the top of the board.
Aggressively going after undrafted free agents is a good thing – keep in mind that >20% of the starters in the NFL last year were UFAs – but we need some more studliness in the pass rush or Brady will be 3/4 receiver sets throwing on every down and picking us apart. Fortunately, Tangini knows this and will keep grinding, which has not been a trait of past management. Expect more trade action.
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Before we anoint the Pats the second-coming of the ’85 Bears, let’s look at some weaknesses. I’m not sold on Maroney and the Pats OL is average. Their LBs are aging and their secondary is iffy with a disgruntled Assante Samuel. Moss isn’t a team cancer, like TO, but he can be a distraction. And, how is he outdoors in cold weather? His whole career has been in a dome or on the West Coast. The Jets have closed the gap with the Pats, especially the talent gap (both on the field and in the front office). I’m expecting a real close race for the AFC East title because both teams have killer schedules and every team in the NFL readies their A game for them, the Jets are still under the radar
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Moss doesn’t have any problem in cold weather. He’s always done very well in Lambeau.
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Bent says: Was wondering if maybe they wanted fewer rookies so that they could focus more closely on working with them and so they can continue to work with last year’s rookies. Maybe they want a higher quotient of veteran players. Anyone got any thoughts?
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Just watched a highlight clip of Stuckey. He reminds me of a less speedy Santana Moss.
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tuco says:
Bent — re, jets spending more time with fewer rookies: They told the undrafted on national TV to be ready for a call. And they’re clearly figuring on bringing in at least 15.
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“On the quantity vs quality debate, here’s one thing to keep in mind: In today’s free agency era, you may only have a player for three years. If you’re only replacing 4 players per year of that pipeline, you can run dry pretty quickly.”
But the draft is a crap shoot as it is. It’s very possible that either Revis and/or Harris don’t pan out, which would leave the Jets even more thin. For a good example of what happens to a team that doesn’t value quantity on draft day, just look at the Washington Redskins.
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muff says:
i hate bill belicheck
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Bent says:
I know that tuco, but I don’t expect more than the usual amount of UDFAs to make it as far as camp and certainly would be surprised to see more than 2 or 3 of them make it to the active roster once the season starts.
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dharvey says:
First, I do count Thomas Jones..we moved down in the second so it involves some aspects of the draft;
Second, we didn’t lose out on the management approach of ‘building through the draft’ If Jones, Revis and Harris pan out, that’s three starters for between two years (Jones) and five to seven years (Revis & Harris)..so ain’t that ‘building’ by any definition?
Third, if our 6th/7th picks develop over the next several years. its pure gravy…
Fourth, you gotta remember the budget ceilings..by only bringing on 4 actual picks, it enables Tangini to stay in control with the budget..this year, next year, ..so that we can RETAIN current vets..just think what they did with Cothery..you gotta look at the whole picture..we need some salary room to keep what we already got.Fifith and last, I’ll bet there are some UFA’s that are gonna do more than make the practice squad..Tangini have done their homework.. there’s one or two UFA’s who are gonna make the final squad and contribute.. and they are gonna be dirt cheap salary wise to boot..
I wouldn’t want to play chess against Tangini.. they are about a dozen moves ahead of all of us! -
if we are truly modeling ourselves after NE, win the Super Bowl 3 of the next 4 years, and then trade a 4th round draft pick for Chad Johnson before the 2012 season [:)
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sjfalcon2001 says:
I’m in the camp of not being too sure about this draft.
I included the Jones trade in my thinking since we included the Jolley trade under Bradway and Edwards previous to this. I like Revis and Harris as well as Jones, but I think we still need to fill more holes than that. We might have given up too much. Trading up for Revis was an aggressive and smart move (and one I agree with), but I’m not so sure about trading up for Harris. I think we might have given up too much to get him. Maybe we can make up for it with UDFA signings and June 2nd cuts, but I think we could have gotten a similar player with one of the picks we had before the trade. Don’t get me wrong, I think Harris will fit, I’m just not sure we should have pulled both trades. Stuckey seems a bit short too, but that’s not necessarily a huge problem if his technique is good.
It’s too early to tell anyway. Chrebet worked out for us, maybe taking a chance on one of these UDFAs will be just what the doctor ordered. We’ll see in 3-4 years. At this point if I were grading, I would optimistically say B-.
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Some notables taken recently by the Jets in rounds 3+:
2006
4th, Brad Smith
4th, Leon Washington2005
4th, Kerry Rhodes
6th, Cedric Houston2004
4th, Jerricho Cotchery
5th, Erik Coleman2003
3rd, BJ Askew
6th, Brooks Bollinger -
RK says:
I don’t think you can compare last year’s draft to this one in that the Jets’ options were limited because of lack of picks and position. Based on the contributing players acquired though the `06 draft it seems to be a success so far. I think this draft too will prove successful even if there are fewer players contributing because that is only a result of the lack of picks.
Why draft players that don’t contribute? A team is much better off getting players that have the greatest potential to do what you expect and want. The only risk is not getting some diamond in the rough but if you are not looking in the rough you are more likely to get the diamond. The way I see it, the Jets were slated to take one player in the top 60 and they wound up with 2 players in the top 50. It doesn’t hurt them next year unless they get to the playoffs and win as a result of the new additions – the desired result anyway.
And yes the Jets are in great shape fiscally which gives them flexibility in how they build from within or without. I think adding only two quality players is important because there are already 21 of 22 starters as mentioned. I don’t foresee any impending contract problems from overachieving players who demand, or deserve more money; hoping there will be such a reason to have money problems.
I’m all for how this draft turned out. I don’t believe in buying things just because they’re on sale but will never get used. You just start to run out of space for those things anyway.
My grade is a B but would be higher if there was a TE that could contribute too.
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wayne says:
You can not count T Jones, he is 30 years old and was signed to free agent money, not second round money. They would have traded the pick in any case and moved up for the same player.
Be satisfied to count him as a terrific free agent signing, but the draft is the draft. Welker is not part of the Pats draft either.
I like Stuckey, he can be Tim Dwight, who may not be back. Similar attributes.
The OT has great upside, but can not contribute this year so still concerned with depth on O Line and yes, TE. I did not want to draft Olsen, but did want to bring in someone. The TE drafted last year is a blocker. Unless Tutt is being converted no idea what happens if Baker goes down.
The UDA class so far is underwhelming, high on intangibles, low on talent. There were 16 players with a grade of 3.40 or higher on the SI data base that went undrafted, Jets signed zero.
In fact, only three of their signing were even in the data base. SS – Peters (HI) 3.29, ILB- Zalewski (WI) 3.10, and DT -Devito (ME) 3.04. All have excellent intangibles, are very good tacklers, but lack speed. Sound familiar?
There will always be the veteran releases by other teams.
I hope they find a way to use the 6 million in cap room, this does not carry over and is a waste to leave on the table.
Also hope they get Mangini locked up, and soon.
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RB Banks of JMU was also in the data base at 3.30, seems like a threat to Cedric, similar style.
I do not count T Jones as part of this class. At the time of the trade they bragged about keeping all their picks, so it is inconsistant to now turn around and say otherwise.
I count T Jones as a free agent signing, since they had to give him a market based contract.
I am on board with the quality vs. quantity concept this year when there were only 18 players with true first round grades.
Also wanted a developmental OT and got one with upside.
Not sure about the 7th round, would have preferred a bigger reciever for red zone, and Patrick might have been nice in the 6th. Could maybe have waited for the tackle.
But the first two rounds have to outweigh the last two, B+, A+ if Revis becomes a pro bowl player.