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	<title>Comments on: D. Rose is Rambling: Off season Let Down</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/</link>
	<description>Ranting and Raving about the Gang Green</description>
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		<title>By: jetscrazy</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75667</link>
		<dc:creator>jetscrazy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 07:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75667</guid>
		<description>to follow up on my statement, by accident pressed enter.....

that matt walsh decides to give in and tell the government about spygate in full so they get their 7th pick docked as well, and belicheck loses another million dollars and us jet fans can drink his evil marklarian tears . but i doubt thatll happen, what with roger goodell having bradys kid or something, and therefore covering up (and as of late burning up) all the indisputible evidence &quot;because there was no reason to review it, or some bs excuse like that.

so i gues my point is WHY IS NO ONE REALIZING THIS. theres obviously something going on, or he wouldnt have burned those tapes. sorry for the tangent but it needed to be said and GO US NEGOTIATING TEAM whooo! get walsh to agree to talk so the jets can take their rightful spot as a mediocre team in a crappy division that now lost its single power. and just for the hell of it, spread their three rings to us, the bills, and the rams. Us and the bills cuz i want one, an the bills are better than us anyway, and the rams is pretty self explanitory. 

Bye now</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to follow up on my statement, by accident pressed enter&#8230;..</p>
<p>that matt walsh decides to give in and tell the government about spygate in full so they get their 7th pick docked as well, and belicheck loses another million dollars and us jet fans can drink his evil marklarian tears . but i doubt thatll happen, what with roger goodell having bradys kid or something, and therefore covering up (and as of late burning up) all the indisputible evidence &#8220;because there was no reason to review it, or some bs excuse like that.</p>
<p>so i gues my point is WHY IS NO ONE REALIZING THIS. theres obviously something going on, or he wouldnt have burned those tapes. sorry for the tangent but it needed to be said and GO US NEGOTIATING TEAM whooo! get walsh to agree to talk so the jets can take their rightful spot as a mediocre team in a crappy division that now lost its single power. and just for the hell of it, spread their three rings to us, the bills, and the rams. Us and the bills cuz i want one, an the bills are better than us anyway, and the rams is pretty self explanitory. </p>
<p>Bye now</p>
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		<title>By: jetscrazy</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75666</link>
		<dc:creator>jetscrazy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 07:34:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75666</guid>
		<description>who cares, what im rooting for the most over the neext couple weeks is that matt walsh decides to</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>who cares, what im rooting for the most over the neext couple weeks is that matt walsh decides to</p>
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		<title>By: 96debacle</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75605</link>
		<dc:creator>96debacle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 19:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75605</guid>
		<description>I think the consensus on this blog is that the first position we needed to address on offense was the line. 
Did they pay Faneca too much? Yes by comparison. 
Is his &quot;intangibles&quot; worth the extra price. maybe maybe not. the next couple of seasons will tell. Regardless we have upgraded at a spot Ross could have started in. Clarke just could not handle the job. Woody upgrades a weak RT. again we had to pay for it. less then Faneca of course but we payed none the less. 

After reading Ross&#039;s article it seems he is taking the money spent a little personal IMO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the consensus on this blog is that the first position we needed to address on offense was the line.<br />
Did they pay Faneca too much? Yes by comparison.<br />
Is his &#8220;intangibles&#8221; worth the extra price. maybe maybe not. the next couple of seasons will tell. Regardless we have upgraded at a spot Ross could have started in. Clarke just could not handle the job. Woody upgrades a weak RT. again we had to pay for it. less then Faneca of course but we payed none the less. </p>
<p>After reading Ross&#8217;s article it seems he is taking the money spent a little personal IMO.</p>
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		<title>By: JustAGreenGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75564</link>
		<dc:creator>JustAGreenGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75564</guid>
		<description>Niel- The O line may be a scape goat, but it was in no way a good line. The writer does know being an O lineman better than us, but clarke was below average and it ISN&#039;T YOUR MONEY. It is in the way that we buy the merchandise and everything else they peddle including tickets, but it didn&#039;t come out of my pocket. I don&#039;t agree with the Woody signing, but I&#039;m no scout and I have thankfully only watched a few Lions games this year. What the FO did was allow themselves options. I think we will still get a RT in the draft, but if we still needed a LG we might have had to not pick up a WR or ILB.

In professional sports it is all monopoly money. You talked about an added block. If there is a better block on the goal line we tie the Browns. For one catch we tie the Ravens game and maybe beat the Redskins. In reality one or two plays a game could really alter the outcome.

Final point: Sports writers exist to cause controversy. I don&#039;t value Prisco or PK or Don Banks opinion. Why start with an ex o lineman who probably got his head bashed in for years? He isn&#039;t a GM or a scout now he is a writer for SI. Woo Hoo!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Niel- The O line may be a scape goat, but it was in no way a good line. The writer does know being an O lineman better than us, but clarke was below average and it ISN&#8217;T YOUR MONEY. It is in the way that we buy the merchandise and everything else they peddle including tickets, but it didn&#8217;t come out of my pocket. I don&#8217;t agree with the Woody signing, but I&#8217;m no scout and I have thankfully only watched a few Lions games this year. What the FO did was allow themselves options. I think we will still get a RT in the draft, but if we still needed a LG we might have had to not pick up a WR or ILB.</p>
<p>In professional sports it is all monopoly money. You talked about an added block. If there is a better block on the goal line we tie the Browns. For one catch we tie the Ravens game and maybe beat the Redskins. In reality one or two plays a game could really alter the outcome.</p>
<p>Final point: Sports writers exist to cause controversy. I don&#8217;t value Prisco or PK or Don Banks opinion. Why start with an ex o lineman who probably got his head bashed in for years? He isn&#8217;t a GM or a scout now he is a writer for SI. Woo Hoo!</p>
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		<title>By: SackDance99</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75547</link>
		<dc:creator>SackDance99</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:55:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75547</guid>
		<description>Neil, I sometimes feel the same frustration with many on this website, but that&#039;s the consequences of an open forum.  I think the Jets spent too much money upgrading the OL, too.  But, I also think Tannenbaum has done a great job structuring the deals and the money spent on the OL should not hamstring the Jets&#039; efforts to improve other areas.  I also believe that players have &quot;intangibles&quot; that independently justify their acquisition beyond on-field performance (of course, you don&#039;t want the intangibles to outweigh performance, the Kimo fiasco and the Schlegel miscue show that there are limits to the value of intangibles).  Faneca, who is an elite LG, has these intangibles and if he makes Brick and Mangold better, then his on-field coaching and leadership offsets the premium placed upon his services.  But, this blog is a fan of FO and it&#039;s sabermetric approach to football.  Statistical analysis treats &quot;intangibles&quot; as irrelevant and football players as essentially fungible.  I completely reject this notion, but many on this blog will praise the Faneca acquisition because of his &quot;intangibles&quot; and then completely discount &quot;intangibles&quot; when evaluating QB, one of the most important leadership positions in pro sports.  Just call out the regulars for their inconsistent positions, especially when I do it :-).

And, fwiw, I am a fan of Woody&#039;s ownership, but let&#039;s put this spending spree in context:  it would never have happened if the Jets weren&#039;t opening a new stadium in 2010 and are trying to sell incredibly expensive luxury boxes and club seats.  Corporations have to view taking clients to a Jets game as a legitimate business development activity and nobody wants to see a 4-12 team struggle through successive meaningless seasons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil, I sometimes feel the same frustration with many on this website, but that&#8217;s the consequences of an open forum.  I think the Jets spent too much money upgrading the OL, too.  But, I also think Tannenbaum has done a great job structuring the deals and the money spent on the OL should not hamstring the Jets&#8217; efforts to improve other areas.  I also believe that players have &#8220;intangibles&#8221; that independently justify their acquisition beyond on-field performance (of course, you don&#8217;t want the intangibles to outweigh performance, the Kimo fiasco and the Schlegel miscue show that there are limits to the value of intangibles).  Faneca, who is an elite LG, has these intangibles and if he makes Brick and Mangold better, then his on-field coaching and leadership offsets the premium placed upon his services.  But, this blog is a fan of FO and it&#8217;s sabermetric approach to football.  Statistical analysis treats &#8220;intangibles&#8221; as irrelevant and football players as essentially fungible.  I completely reject this notion, but many on this blog will praise the Faneca acquisition because of his &#8220;intangibles&#8221; and then completely discount &#8220;intangibles&#8221; when evaluating QB, one of the most important leadership positions in pro sports.  Just call out the regulars for their inconsistent positions, especially when I do it :-).</p>
<p>And, fwiw, I am a fan of Woody&#8217;s ownership, but let&#8217;s put this spending spree in context:  it would never have happened if the Jets weren&#8217;t opening a new stadium in 2010 and are trying to sell incredibly expensive luxury boxes and club seats.  Corporations have to view taking clients to a Jets game as a legitimate business development activity and nobody wants to see a 4-12 team struggle through successive meaningless seasons.</p>
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		<title>By: Bent</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75515</link>
		<dc:creator>Bent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:55:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75515</guid>
		<description>FWIW, he raises a good point, but shouldn&#039;t the comparison be between Faneca and Clarke?  If so, then the Jets are likely to get far more than 1 or 2 plays a game even if Faneca is just competent.

For the same reason, I don&#039;t see Woody as a small upgrade.  Clement was terrible last year, so even if Woody is only average that will be more than just a small upgrade.

As the author notes, the Jets are banking on the fact that the intangibles these guys will bring will ultimately make the investment worthwhile.  (Like Mike Tanier&#039;s ESPN/FO article about how Faneca could improve 4 positions).

Yes, we overpaid.  Yes, we need better playmaking and QB play, but none of these deals is a cap killer, so hopefully we will fill the roster in good time.

PS - I don&#039;t know where you get the idea that any of the posters here like Woody Johnson.  Some people have defended him as &quot;not as bad as Leon Hess or James Dolan&quot;, but that&#039;s about as far as it went...certainly not as far as any bodily orafice, which is an image I&#039;d rather not have to read about on here again if you wouldn&#039;t mind!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FWIW, he raises a good point, but shouldn&#8217;t the comparison be between Faneca and Clarke?  If so, then the Jets are likely to get far more than 1 or 2 plays a game even if Faneca is just competent.</p>
<p>For the same reason, I don&#8217;t see Woody as a small upgrade.  Clement was terrible last year, so even if Woody is only average that will be more than just a small upgrade.</p>
<p>As the author notes, the Jets are banking on the fact that the intangibles these guys will bring will ultimately make the investment worthwhile.  (Like Mike Tanier&#8217;s ESPN/FO article about how Faneca could improve 4 positions).</p>
<p>Yes, we overpaid.  Yes, we need better playmaking and QB play, but none of these deals is a cap killer, so hopefully we will fill the roster in good time.</p>
<p>PS &#8211; I don&#8217;t know where you get the idea that any of the posters here like Woody Johnson.  Some people have defended him as &#8220;not as bad as Leon Hess or James Dolan&#8221;, but that&#8217;s about as far as it went&#8230;certainly not as far as any bodily orafice, which is an image I&#8217;d rather not have to read about on here again if you wouldn&#8217;t mind!</p>
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		<title>By: Bent</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75513</link>
		<dc:creator>Bent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:48:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75513</guid>
		<description>Here is a link to the article Neil references above:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/ross_tucker/03/26/oline.salaries1/index.html?eref=si_topstories</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is a link to the article Neil references above:</p>
<p><a href="http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/ross_tucker/03/26/oline.salaries1/index.html?eref=si_topstories" rel="nofollow">http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/ross_tucker/03/26/oline.salaries1/index.html?eref=si_topstories</a></p>
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		<title>By: neil herschkowitz</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75508</link>
		<dc:creator>neil herschkowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:04:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75508</guid>
		<description>WOW...I have been ranting about all the money we have spent in free agency on OL. A major thrust of my posts questions the specific difference between an average OL and an elite one. 

I constantly took flack from the same group of posters...all 6 of you that within each and every post , every opportunity you get blame the OL for anything and everything that made our offense impotent. When I talk about the fact that we have no QB....oh its the OL....we have no playmakers....oh its the OL....we went 4-12....oh its the OL. So when the FO overpaid to get an OL upgrade....and Woody is a small upgrade at best you same 6 guys that seem to have your nose firmly placed in the Johnson&amp;Johnson anal anatomy sounded like cheerleading squad for FO and ownership.

It did my heart well to read what a real offensive lineman had to say about that . Not an arm chair wanna be...a former offensve lineman.

As a matter of comparison, an elite player like Hutchinson may go through an entire season and only give up one sack and five pressures, assuming he has an outstanding season. In addition, let&#039;s factor into the equation the reality that Hutchinson may be able to use his talent to make one more block in the running game every other Sunday than I would have.

Strictly by the numbers, that means that an upper echelon player would give up two fewer sacks and five fewer pressures, and probably make one more block in the running game in eight games over the course of the season. That means the difference between one of the highest paid guards in the league like Hutchinson and a journeyman interior backup like me is approximately 15 plays over the course of the season, give or take a few.

Let&#039;s take similar numbers and project them on the more current example of Faneca and DeMulling. Offensive linemen are often given grades by their position coaches after games -- plusses for good plays, minuses for bad plays. A guy like Faneca might have four minuses a game out of 65 plays. DeMulling would likely have five or six.

Every NFL team would prefer to have Faneca as their starting left guard, that much is clear. What is significantly less clear is how much more a team should be willing to pay to have Faneca. How much is 10-15 plays over the course of the season worth?

To the Jets, the number is $21 million in guaranteed money.

• It could be the difference. Or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WOW&#8230;I have been ranting about all the money we have spent in free agency on OL. A major thrust of my posts questions the specific difference between an average OL and an elite one. </p>
<p>I constantly took flack from the same group of posters&#8230;all 6 of you that within each and every post , every opportunity you get blame the OL for anything and everything that made our offense impotent. When I talk about the fact that we have no QB&#8230;.oh its the OL&#8230;.we have no playmakers&#8230;.oh its the OL&#8230;.we went 4-12&#8230;.oh its the OL. So when the FO overpaid to get an OL upgrade&#8230;.and Woody is a small upgrade at best you same 6 guys that seem to have your nose firmly placed in the Johnson&amp;Johnson anal anatomy sounded like cheerleading squad for FO and ownership.</p>
<p>It did my heart well to read what a real offensive lineman had to say about that . Not an arm chair wanna be&#8230;a former offensve lineman.</p>
<p>As a matter of comparison, an elite player like Hutchinson may go through an entire season and only give up one sack and five pressures, assuming he has an outstanding season. In addition, let&#8217;s factor into the equation the reality that Hutchinson may be able to use his talent to make one more block in the running game every other Sunday than I would have.</p>
<p>Strictly by the numbers, that means that an upper echelon player would give up two fewer sacks and five fewer pressures, and probably make one more block in the running game in eight games over the course of the season. That means the difference between one of the highest paid guards in the league like Hutchinson and a journeyman interior backup like me is approximately 15 plays over the course of the season, give or take a few.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s take similar numbers and project them on the more current example of Faneca and DeMulling. Offensive linemen are often given grades by their position coaches after games &#8212; plusses for good plays, minuses for bad plays. A guy like Faneca might have four minuses a game out of 65 plays. DeMulling would likely have five or six.</p>
<p>Every NFL team would prefer to have Faneca as their starting left guard, that much is clear. What is significantly less clear is how much more a team should be willing to pay to have Faneca. How much is 10-15 plays over the course of the season worth?</p>
<p>To the Jets, the number is $21 million in guaranteed money.</p>
<p>• It could be the difference. Or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75502</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 04:04:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75502</guid>
		<description>I say Coles and a 4th for Lito

its much harder to develop a good corner...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I say Coles and a 4th for Lito</p>
<p>its much harder to develop a good corner&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Idiot Parade</title>
		<link>http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/03/26/d-rose-is-rambling-off-season-let-down/#comment-75494</link>
		<dc:creator>Idiot Parade</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thejetsblog.com/?p=3762#comment-75494</guid>
		<description>This is weak.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is weak.</p>
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