TJB Scout: New York Giants
This week, it’s the annual preseason (and thus meaningless) Battle of New York as the Jets square off against their cross-stadium rivals, the defending Super Bowl champion New York Giants.
Of course, with the amount of media coverage, ink and hype that’s been given to the Jets from the ever-wise pundits of the New York media and the scribes of the local tabloids, you’d think that the Jets were the team who had won the Lombardi Trophy last season. Fortunately, we know that the games are played on the field and not the back pages — all you have to do is look to the last game the Giants played which counted, last February — so let’s see how the champs stack up.
East Rutherford, are you ready for a preseason rummmmble?
Cheerleader check: “Oh, we’re too classy for cheerleaders blah blah blah we have a long-standing no cheerleader tradition blah blah blah we won a Super Bowl blah blah blah.” Well guess what? If you don’t have cheerleaders, then they don’t get to do Maxim photo shoots (like at right), now do they?
Game specifics: The game is Saturday night, 7 pm, at the Meadowlands, technically a Jets home game. It’s a very good Field Turf surface that both teams know well. The weather forecast says it should be an absolutely gorgeous night — mid 70s, clear skies, low humidity — so the normally fearsome winds should not be an issue, nor should there be any condition which favors one team over another.
Record: The Gints are 1-1 in the preseason, which means about as much as Tiki Barber did to last year’s Super Bowl run.
Barometer: Being preseason, the barometric pressure is still at zero. If it was the regular season, however, I’d say something like, “Whenever you beat an undefeated team coached by Bill Belichick and quarterbacked by Tom Brady to win a Super Bowl, the barometer a-splodes.”
Old Friends: Right tackle Kareem McKenzie now has a diamond-encrusted ring to go with the big contract the Giants gave him a few years ago, as does running back Derrick Ward. In a deju vu all over again, running back Danny Ware, who was cut from the Jets last year after a decent training camp, is trying to win a slot with the Giants. And it might only count for me, but offensive coordinator (and New Haven, Connecticut, native) Kevin Gilbride was the head coach at my alma mater — Southern Connecticut State University — when I was an undergraduate. He came back to campus recently (with the Lombardi Trophy in tow) and provided an entertaining evening for Patriot-hating football fans of all stripes.
Questions: Can the Giants repeat their glorious success from last season? Will Strahan’s leadership of the defense be missed? Did Tom Coughlin laugh best when he got the last laugh on everyone who tried to run him out of town? How soon before Giants fans start booing Eli Manning again? Why doesn’t this team have cheerleaders?
Key injuries: As it is preseason, anybody with boo boo will be watching from the bench.
Five things to know about the Giants offense:
- Plaxiglass bends but doesn’t break – The seemingly perpetually injured Plaxico Burress is getting near “100%” healthy, but as he proved last year, that isn’t necessary for him to perform at high levels. Still, don’t expect to see anything of him aside from standing around in sweats on the sidelines.
- Dr. Eli and Mr. Manning – As anyone who has even casually watched the Giants can tell you, there is really no in-between with Eli Manning — he can go three quarters (or an entire regular season) looking horrid, then suddenly without warning can lead the Giants to a dramatic victory.
- The walking wounded – In addition to Burress, the Giants receiving corps has been dealing with injuries to Amani (It’s Not A) Toomer, the other Steve Smith, Brandon London and Mario Manningham. When healthy, the running game is potent, with bruiser Brandon Jacobs, shifty Ahmad Bradshaw and the all-around solid Ward.
- Meet the new Boss, same as the old Boss? – With Jeremy Shockey down in the Crescent City with Jonathan Vilma and the Saints, the team is looking to second-year tight end Kevin Boss to continue the stellar play he demonstrated during last season’s run.
- Baby, can you drive with Carr? – Former top draft pick David Carr is struggling to win the backup quarterback job, and with a recent back injury to Anthony Wright (he’s still around?), figures to see extensive action on Saturday night.
Jersey watch (offense): #87 Domenik Hixon had two TD receptions as well as a free kick return for a TD versus the Browns last week.
Five things to know about the Giants defense:
- Tuck and roll – The Giants gave Justin Tuck a five-year $31 million deal not because they needed someone to replace Michael Strahan, but because Tuck has proven to be a beast on the line — ask the Patriots.
- Feel the heat – As anyone who watched the Super Bowl — and that would be about a billion people — knows, the Giants are very good at rushing the passer. Very good. Very, very good.
- Primary secondary – After enjoying a terrific playoff run last season, the long-abused Giants secondary with Webster and second-year corner Aaron Ross has started to emerge as a quality group under the tutelege of highly coveted defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo.
- A safety in the numbers? – Rookie Kenny Philips is having a strong camp and looks to replace the departed Gibril Wilson.
- Webster is no longer the answer . . . . – to the question “Who was the last player to intercept Brett Favre?”
Jersey watch (defense): The #91 of Tuck can wreak a bit of havoc.
Three things about the Giants special teams:
- A kick in the Tynes – Placekicker Lawrence Tynes is supposed to be out for 10 days with a knee injury and he’s having exploratory surgery on it — there have been reports he may be gone for the season. He is currently being replaced by Josh Huston, who kicked well in preseason last year.
- Father Time – Punter Jeff Feagles is entering his 112th season in the NFL, and still is averaging over 40 yards a punt.
- Getting the kicks in with Hixon – The aforementioned Hixon is a duly-designated special teams ace, although the Giants special teams have struggled a bit this summer.
What to expect from the broadcast booth: Well, they should talk about a team who is in good position to defend their Super Bowl championship with a great young core, but I’m sure there’ll be much clucking of tongues about all the players (Shockey, Tiki, Strahan, etc.) who are no longer there.
Spotlight matchup: The Giants defensive line should provide an excellent test for the the revamped Jets offensive line — especially watch as Damien Woody squares off against Tuck.
The pressure is on: Like in every preseason game, it’s on every player who is on the bubble and fighting for a roster spot. It’d be nice for Mike Nugent to have a nice bounce-back night — and I don’t mean like last week, when his kicks were bouncing back off the uprights.
What could go wrong? Tuck crushes Favre, sees him driven before him, and hears the lamentation of the Flight Crew.
What could go right? The Jets first-team defense continues to improve and holds the strong Giants rushing game in check.
Bottom line: The defending champs should prove to be a good measuring stick for the progress of Favre and the revamped Jets.
42 Responses to TJB Scout: New York Giants
-
steviek says:
run the ball and stop the run and all will be well.
-
Harvlis says:
That is an old criticism of Eli Manning. I believe that he has come into his own. He is a legitimate threat. Of course, the Giants D-Line is where it all begins. If we can game plan to neutralize them, all will be well. Can’t wait.
-
Nikolas says:
The success of Dedrick Ward and Danny Ware with the Giants is –if not a testament-a worrisome sign for the Jets coaching and player evaluation. As a mater of fact, Leo Washington somehow seems underutilized and Thomas Jones shows a lot of muscle which does not translate on the field. If this year the Jets running game is not strong-not just better- then we can easily infer that the problem is with coaching.
The Giants seem loaded in all positions, in my opinion they are the team to beat. The problem with tomorrow’s game is that the Giants will not try very hard to hit Favre, it is a preseason game, and Favre now is the Golden Cow of CBS, he is business and NFL ratings. So I do not think we can infer much on how good the OL is in protection, but we can definitely get an idea how good the running game is and how good the defense is. -
Najy says:
The way you nuetrualize any pass rushing D-line is by counters, screens, draws, and smash mouth football. We should be fine if we put ourselves in 3rd and manageable.
D’brick dominated O.C Uminura last year during the regualr season so i am not worried about hat. Brick is a 4th overall pick so he better be prepared and handel his business. I am a little concerned about woody only because i havent seen much of him yet but I have seen a lot of Tuck. Should be interesting. look for the FB or RB to help out with Woody.
-
kc says:
I wonder if on the giants site they have FAVRE in CROSSHAIRS!!?? man i hope not!
-
Nikolas –
For the record, Ward was signed off the practice squad in ’04 under Hermway’s watch.
-
SackDance99 says:
Besides Ward not being a present FO issue, it should be noted that the Giants would not have needed to sign any RB off the Jets practice squad if they had not traded Ryan Grant to the Pack before last season for a measley 6th round pick. I guess such an idiotic move would be “a testament-a worrisome sign for the [Giants] coaching and player evaluation” except for the fact that the Giants won the Super Bowl with superb production from both free agent signees and draft picks. At RB, it’s a numbers game and often times guys like Grant or Ware don’t get enough reps to show their stuff. That the Giants signed Ware last year is indicative of nothing.
-
WOW. I am not sure where Nikolas gets his info but this coaching staff had nothing to do with D Ward getting signed away by the Giants. That was Bradway?Herm my boy.
-
So if the Jets block the Giants well on pass protection it’s beacuse Favre is the NFL’s Golden boy?? This Nikolas amazes me…….Plus to say the Giants are loaded is a bit of an reach. Who are their LB’s besides Pierce? Who is playing in the secondary? Remember before the run they had in the playoffs the LB’s and secondary were horrible!!
-
RK says:
I don’t think that is fair Drew. They are young in the secondary but they look competent. I’d say the pressure on the QB makes them look better but they are not a gaping weakness.
-
Sackdance..enough nonsense. Coughlin knew all along that Grant was a good RB, they did not want to carry 5 of them;. Jacobs, Ward, Bradsaw, Droughns, Grant, not a bad line-up. Go and search to find who was our 3rd RB from last year!
And please….you sound so silly when you make comparisons between the GM and Coaching of the Giants with what the Jets have. They do not belong in the same category.Moreover, the lame excuse that Ward was not under the Tennebaum and Mangini regime ..what about the rest of the scouting and evaluation department of the Jets? Aren’t they part of the organization with input in the decision making?
You all sound like Tangini’s neurotic kids. -
the GIANTS “not trying very hard to hit FAVRE”(nikolas) is NOT A PROBLEM! its a BLESSING!
-
KC ..you are right, if this is the case.
And Drew …I know that my anti-FO reputation precedes my arguments when you read them, but please…
What I was trying to say, is that this is a preseason game and that you can not read too much on the pass protection of the OL, because the Giants may not go full blast, for good reasons.
Instead you should be paying more attention on the Jets running game and on the defense.
What…. you don’t understand is not my reasoning but rather that your indignation..is unfounded. -
altho for the record,if the giants do go easy(i dont know if i beleive they will…hope so tho) i get what your saying on how we wont be able to see the O-LINE at full speed/strength…..
-
Do you think the Browns thought the same thing when Usi knocked D Anderson out with a concussion last week? I agree the Run D and O are the things I am looking for but to say the Giants wont hit Favre is silly. This is the game they get to go hard for a full half. Plus don’t think they like that the Favre/Jets have been getting all of the press off of thier SB win
-
KC, the problem with this team is running the ball, defend the run!
I know people have high expectations about the pass offense. I do not!
If the Jets do not establish a well above average running game the season is over! Favre is not the savior! -
RK…My point was the secondary was getting killed by the Giants fans and media before they played a couple of nice games in the post season. For Nikolas to refer the Giants as “loaded” at all positions is off. Ross, Webster, S Knight, K Phillips, loaded????
-
NOT taking anything away from the G-MEN..KUDOS on winning the superbowl and STOPPING bill belicheat and the “PERFECT”season,but that last quater was amazing/unbelievable. FIRST of all the PATS did what they were SUPPOSE to do….come down and SCORE to take the lead with two minutes left(against a DEFENSE that was giving them FITS all night none the less). NOW,the amazing/unbelievable part…..ELI actually should have THROWN the GAME LOSING INTERCEPTION. how the “BEST” CORNER in the league pulls a BILLY BUCKNER and lets the ball go RIGHT through his hands!?GAME OVER.but NO. THEN,in any other game during the season,the whistle would have blown for ELI being in the grasp!NO WHISTLE. then proceeds to throw a HAIL MARY to tyree who probably made the best catch in any postseason ever.(arguably) THEN,with the “BEST”cornerback in the league,wouldnt you think they would put him on the giants BEST reciever!? HOW PLAX could get THAT open for the SUPERBOWL WINNING CATCH still BAFFLES me! I really dont know how ALL THAT happened in the final TWO minutes……… but im SURE GLAD IT DID!
-
Drew –
I was a bit rushed while doing the scout, but I meant to mention how the Giants knocked Anderson silly — good point.
I still have flashbacks of Chad holding his dangling broken wrist courtesy of Brandon Short and the Giants during a preseason game. I don’t think they’ll be holding back any …
-
…if the Giants go full blast just pray.
-
Nikolas, you proved my point! The reason the Giants didn’t keep Grant was because of the numbers game at RB; something that every team faces. As for the Jets, they decided two only have 2 tailbacks on the roster: Jones and Washington, and 2 fullbacks, Tutt and Barnes. Plus, Brad Smith could’ve stepped in at RB, if needed. Different offense from the Giants; thus, different needs. Plus, the Jets, to my knowledge, didn’t need a 3rd tailback all season.
Your statement that “Couhglin knew Grant was a good RB” is ridiculous. Grant wasn’t just good, he ended up being better than every RB on the Giants roster…by far. He was only the 7th RB in NFL history to rush for over 200 yards in a playoff game!!! It would help your arguments if you occassionally concede a point…it was an unmitigated blunder by the Giants to let Grant go and if the Giants had failed to make the playoffs, letting Grant go would’ve been one of the chief reasons to fire Coughlin. Like the saying goes, winning is the best deodorant.
And no comparison? How about 2006? The Jets with far inferior talent to the Giants, go 10-6. The Giants barely squeak into the playoffs and underachieved all year at 8-8. Again, the Giants great playoff run and Super Bowl win was great deodorant, but coming into 2007, Coughlin in his first 3 years with the Giants had 1 winning season (a 25-23 regular season record) and two embarassing 1st round playoff losses (in ’05 the 11-5 Giants were blanked 23-0 by the Panthers). All of this in the NFC, the weaker conference.
So, let’s see how Mangini and Tannenbaum are after their 3rd season together; it won’t be hard to match Coughlin and the Giants FO.
-
nyckage says:
if we hold the giants below 80 rushing yds , that is a good sign because all there backs are good , and now we can really test our O line against the only time who downed brady’s ass every play
-
BubbyBrister/shovelpass says:
Nikolas – I agree with you. Good cows don’t eat cheese, or whatever point you were trying to make.
Ask Derek Andersen if the Giants defense wasn’t trying to hit him? Hard! All these guys have been chomping at the bit to hit someone (for real!). There is just so much practice “dancing” a player can take. Some guys on the bubble will stop at nothing, including Favre, to make the team! There is no way the Jets or the Giants won’t be ” putting on the foil, coach” come saturday.
But if you think that they will be laying off for ‘obvious reasons’, then what does that say about the FO? (hee-hee, I couldn’t resist it)
-
Bilal says:
Sack,
I understand the point you are making about the Giants cutting Grant but how can you say that Grant is clearly better than any of the Giants RB? Yes he had 200 yards in the divisional playoff, but he followed that up with 13 att 29 yards in the NFC championship game(also 1 rec for -3 yards)! Lets forget about stats, just by watching these guys I rather have Ahmad Bradshaw or a healthy Brandon Jacobs!
-
Bilal,
Really? Grant only started 7 games last year, nearly had 1,000 yards and had a 5.1 per carry average. He also had 30 receptions. He had 2 runs for over 60 yards (for TDs), and two more 20+ yard runs that resulted in TDs. He had 8 rushing TDs in those 7 starts. Grant is the rare back that runs hard between the tackles and has breakaway speed.
Jacobs, with an equally impressive 5.0 yards per carry, nearly had as good a season as Grant, but he started 2 more games, had 2 fewer TDs, fewer long runs, and fewer receptions. Grant had the better season.
Bradshaw was an impressive change-of-pace back and his 8.3 yards per carry were impressive, but he only had 23 carries, no starts, and in the playoffs, with more carries, had a still good, but more typical 4.3 yard per carry average.
Subjectively, you may like Jacobs and Bradshaw more, but statistically, Grant is the better back and, in your comparison, the best thing that happened to Jacobs and Bradshaw is that they didn’t have to run against the Giants defensive line in frigid weather conditions.
-
Yes my opinion was very subject, which is why I said ignore the stats.
Jacobs and Bradshaw split carries in the same frigid conditions against arguable the most complete defense in the NFC last year. They each had 60 yards. Grant looked horrible in that game!
In Grants last 6 games(including the playoffs but not including the season finale which he barely played) he had 9 receptions for 25 yards. And I’m being fair by not including the season finale just to prove my point. He looks way to tall when he runs kinda like Chris Brown. Your best argument is that he is a homerun hitter and proved it weekly.
Bradshaw is more that just a change of pace back. He runs surprisingly strong between the tackles for such a small guy. I just like the toughness, speed and quickness of Bradshaw.
At the same time I can see why you or anyone else would have this arugment with me. You just can’t sit there and say that the Giants are kicking themselves for dumping Grant after they fell in love with Bradshaw in training camp.
-
very subjective, not subject
-
I doubt that the Giants are “kicking” themselves. They won the Super Bowl without Grant. But, because of the numbers game at RB, they let Grant go and, if Grant continues to show the promise he showed last season, it would be hard not to view letting Grant go as a mistake.
Subjectively, I like Grant more than Jacobs or Bradshaw. He’s big, 6-1, 218 lbs, can run between the tackles and also can break off long runs with his sprinter’s speed. I just think he’s a more complete back than either Jacobs or Bradshaw. So, from a Jets fan’s perspective, I’m glad they traded him for a 6th rounder.
-
SackDance..you have turn yourself into the master of hyperbolic statements and you call mine rediculus?
Only you can make statements like;“Grant wasn’t just good, he ended up being better than every RB on the Giants roster…by far.”
Is that so? Not only “better” but also by “far”?
I have told you before, that real football and fantasy football are not the same. Quit making stupid interpretations of statistics. You are no good on that.
And the statement that I made about the Giants was not mine it was Coughlin’s.
With regard to the Jets 10-6 season..it was primarily due to Chad. Tannebaum and Mangini had no part on it, when they started messing up they took a 10-6 team and made it a 4-12 team.
-
Bilal,
I also find curious your “too tall” criticism. Jacobs is 6-4 and has an upright running style, without the elusiveness of Grant. He reminds me of Christian Okoye, whose career was over after 6 years…this is Jacobs 4th season.
-
Nikolas,
Like your command of the English language, your arguments are awful. Grant was far better statistically. But, more than that, he had a worse OL than Jacobs, his only competition on the Giants. In 7 starts and fewer carries he equaled or exceeded Jacobs in every statistical category. Plus, Grant had a historic playoff game against the Seahawks and a bad game against the Giants. Jacobs was mediocre in the playoffs…not a single 100-yard game and a 3.2 per carry average…Bradshaw was the better back.
So, statistics support my allegedly “hyperbolic” statements, but what supports your fatuous statements besides mental flatulence?
-
Sackdance, I guess now you are an English professor too. Right?
-
ramble914 says:
The Jets this year, despite Favre, should be a run first and pass second offense. If we can establish the run early an often, then the passing game will come. We should have the players now to be a dominant running offense, and with Favre and our stable of receivers, it will open up the passing game. Of course it all depends on our OL, hopefully the money was well spent. Tomorrow’s game against the Giants will reveal a lot about how our offense will fare this season.
As someone earlier in this string pointed out (steviek), “stop the run and run the ball”, again, tomorrow’s game will tell a lot about our new defense, I say new because this is the first year under Tangini that they have all the pieces in place for Mangini’s 3-4. We have to keep the Giants run game in check, last season they ran roughshod on us, so this year, this game, will be a good barometer of our improvement, or lack of.
Tomorrow nights game will be very interesting, as well as telling.
-
Nikolas,
The 10-6 season was primarily due to Chad?
So the emergence of Cotchery had nothing to do with it? Mangini gave him a shot that he was never given before and he excelled. Coles also had a great year. Leon Washington, drafted by tanenbaum, made big plays like the one in Miami. After the bye week the Jets 3/4 defense really came into its own. Kerry Rhodes came into his own that year, Bryan Thomas had a career year and people forget that Robertson wasn’t that bad that year in 3/4. IMO, 2006 is the year Chad showed signs of why he could never win a superbowl ie. the Bears game that he practically gave away.
I really like your approach here, you have a platform and will stick to it at all costs. Chad is great, FO is terrible. blah blah blah. You tell people to stop being delusional but you act the same on the opposite side of the spectrum. You have this “im too cool for school” attitude. But as a Jets fan you can’t say that this FO regime is worse than the previous one! Every move they made this year filled a hole that previously existed.
-
Sack,
Yes i used Jacobs but which RB was I really talking about? I only mentioned Jacobs in my argument when I said he had 60 yards in that cold weather game. I really think Bradshaw is a better talent on the field and time will only tell.
As far as Jacobs height? The NFL has never seen a RB with the size of Jacobs, not even Okoye. I think Jacobs has talents along with his height that make him different, Grant doesn’t even come close in terms of strength in between the tackles.
-
Bilal….my statement was… “primarily” due to Chad, not due to Chad. The contribution of so many other players cannot be ignored, that is why I said “primarily”.
Sackdance….My command of the English language may be awful, but your critical thinking is worst than my awful command. These two statements do not convey the same message.
“Grant wasn’t just good, he ended up being better than every RB on the Giants roster…by far.”“Grant was far better statistically”
…And they are yours!
-
Brandon "You're With Me"riweather says:
just to throw my 2 cents into this – I’d prefer Grant to Jacobs, but primarily because jacobs is so injury prone. On a carry for carry – guaranteed to never get injured fantasyland – comparison, I think I’d probably go with Jacobs.
-
Nikolas, you really are a rare breed. But, I want to help you. The first statement “Grant wasn’t just good, he ended up being better than every RB on the Giants roster…by far” is a conclusion. The second statement “Grant was far better statistically” was the evidence supporting the conclusion (if my old friend seanmac were around, he’d probably disagree because Jacobs had a higher DVOA last season than Grant, but Grant had better stats in every category, especially if you include post-season stats). Your criticism, thus, is inaccurate, but as the season goes on, I’m sure you’ll learn to structure your arguments better (you should have just pointed out Jacobs’ higher DVOA because that would detract from the foundation of my conclusion…I’ll keep on helping you) or, if you don’t know what you are talking about, just remain silent. As Abraham Lincoln said “Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.”
Brandon, if your argument is that Jacobs never goes backwards, so on a carry for carry basis he’s a better back than Grant, I understand your argument. But, Grant can break off a 60+ yard run and Jacobs just doesn’t have that type of speed. He also fumbles more than Grant because of his upright, bruising style. I like Grant’s style and upside more; but, Jacobs is an effective back. He just won’t survive the pounding he takes with his style, like Okoye before him.
-
sack –
jacobs has displayed a little breakaway speed on his 43 yard romp against Buffalo last year (of course grant is better in this regard).
I’d also prefer Jacobs (in my my never injured fantasyland) is that with his build, if you can ever give him 25-30 carries a game, he’ll start to wear down the defense much like Bettis used to do – and I think he’d be a more effective back than grant. Of course, in reality, you can barely give him 10 carries before he twists a knee – and that’s why i’d prefer grant in this unfortunate oft-injured reality.
-
Mark says:
Anyone know where I can see the game tonight online. I live in UK so its not on television
Big test for our revamped O-line. I know in’t only pre-season but if they can keep those animals on the Giants D-line off of Favre….the league will be on notice.