Audible: Ground Challenged?
So, there’s been a lot of talk about this, but do you think that this team is challenged when it comes to running the ball? Why or why not? Is it still too early to tell?
39 Responses to Audible: Ground Challenged?
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swizzle81 says:
Too early, the running game is usually the last portion to “gel” and it will once the Jets play the Fins in week one.
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JustAGreenGuy says:
Jones doesn’t pick up major yards until he gets to around 15 carries. He wears down defenses. It will improve.
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nyckage says:
well you should be concerned at a certain level , but you should really be concerned in the miami game if TJ does not
atleast get 80 yards rushing then im concerned , but until then lets not press the panic button -
Keith says:
Do you think the Jets are showing all their cards during preseason. I don’t.
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Running behind an inferior line and against Jason Taylor in Week 13 last December, Jones logged 75 yards and a TD, (while Leon added 68 and a pair of scores) — I would think (hope) that behind a better line and against a weaker Dolphin defense, he should post better numbers …
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StuytownKC says:
Pre-season limitations and focusing on getting Favre comfortable I think have limited the carries and options for TJ and Lil Leon. Although Mangini’s practices have been shorter this year, doesn’t he still run a grueling camp that could easily fatigue our RBs legs for now, but strengthen them for later in games and later in the season? Also, going up against the Giants (before losing Osi) and Redskins defenses plus the Browns D with Shaun Rogers addition is a pretty solid trio to go against for the first three times. Phins D will be nothing compared to them
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man2man_cover says:
I read or heard it somewhere that this ‘problem’ is the result of practicing against a 3-4 defensive alignment in camp while they’ve played exclusively against 4-3 defenses during the first three pre-season games.
I can certainly see the logic why they would practice going heavily against a 3-4 defense considering that their first two opponents run that system.
Granted that we shouldn’t take the pre-season too seriously but consider this, our pass blocking has been good and the Offensive Line has managed well, for the most part, in keeping Favre’s jersey in pristine condition.
The rushing attack will come. But for now we should really be thankful that the team’s emphasis thus far has been protecting our legendary greybeard.
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DaveTN says:
If the Jets had run the ball well in the past few years, it wouldn’t be worrying. As it is, yeah, there are possible reasons why the running game might be better, but I sure would rather that Jones were ripping preseason defenses apart…
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DSmizzle says:
I don’t think its acceptable that Thomas Jones “needs 20+ carries to wear down a defense”.
So does this statement mean that we can accept that he won’t do anything until about the 3rd quarter and we’ll have to pass all day prior to him getting his “magic number” of carries?
I don’t like that statement (not the observation, but what it says about him). They can’t struggle all game until the 3rd quarter.
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pat d says:
The Jets have looked better with Leon in at RB.He is faster and more of a threat in the passing game. I don’t know if Thomas Jones is going to get 20 carries.
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billvv says:
I think what was meant was that the yards per carry would increase as the defense wore down, which probably is true of any team. I think they resolved not to get any running back hurt with unnecessary work in preseason, doing enough to see if the line blocking was ready. I’m not sure that they should be considered ready.
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15 carries +. He will also not have 8 in the box and the line is still gelling. If he sucks against Miami. Use Leon and Jesse. We have had worse issues.
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Dan C says:
No.
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Lageman says:
I think having Jones and Leon Washington behind a revamped line, the best fullback of the last ten years, albeit an old one, a quarterback that forces defenses to play beyond 10 yards is going to create a lot of opportunities. Jones will be solid for 75 yards a game and Leon is the exact change of pace back needed to spring some big gains. I expect to not get nearly as agitated watching them run on first and second down and then watch the Jets try to execute a 3rd and 8 all year long.
I can’t wait for the season to start, although if we lose to Pennington it will be a devastating start to the season.
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KevT says:
TJ’s ypc on a per game basis is low to begin with, meaning the first half or so it’s even lower if he is breaking off bigger gains after running at the defense so much initially. That would be fine if we kept games close or got a big early lead.
One positive factor might be Brett’s passing would bring fewer men in the box. Since playcalling has been plain vanilla, those opportunities should increase.
I’d be curious to see how the Jets start out each game. Do they continue to set the tone with more runs as in the past or come out throwing in some (not all) situations. If the passing game truly becomes the best part of their offense, then the run can be used in the first half to keep defenses honest (not vice versa) and can be used in fourth quarter to preserve leads and run down the clock.
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vbsiena24 says:
Too early to tell. Wait until week 4 and I think we can make the decision then.
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lou says:
Think about this. We have TJ last year and he ran for 1000 and 1 touchdown. This year we have a superior line to the one last year and a fullback to compliment the run. I do not see any reason to be concerned at all TJ will be fine and so will our run game. If not bring in Leon and he will get the job done. No need to worry I think they are just taking it easy and working on the passing game with Favre
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Harvlis says:
It will take a few games to get it together but, Favre’s ability to throw the ball all over the field will open up the running game for TJ. Favre is in learning mode. Once he feels comfortable, everything will come together. Like all of you, I just hope it comes together in time to squish the fish.
Leon has looked very good this pre-season. He is going to have an amazing year. You should pre-order his highlight video.
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Johnny Styne says:
Jones has shown less than Gholston in the preseason — Washington and Chatman have both shown a lot — Give Jones through the bye week — If he doesn’t step it up by then, bench him –
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BubbyBrister/shovelpass says:
Johnny – only a benching? What gives? After we dump Coles, Cotchery and everyone else on the team you don’t like, we will have plenty of room for more RBs… :-)
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john r says:
in really think thomas jones is going to be a surprise this season. one of the reason why the run game hasnt looked great is bc we are working with a new unit that still needs time to come together
but thank god we play miami first this season so we get the energy running just in time to f the nation up
so with thomas jones as the main back and leon just being leon, i have high hopes, real high hopes -
My point is Leon can be more than just being Leon.
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BubbyBrister/shovelpass — Cotchery is awesome –
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Fonzie says:
The pressure is on Mangini in the first game against the dolphins folks. Remember that!!! Who cares who we have, if they are not ready then we will wont beat anybody and it looks as if mangini has competition at the head coaching spot and his only competition no one other than BRETT FAVRE!! It will be interesting who wins at the end of the season. My money is on favre, anyone else agree with me?
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dakar says:
pat d
im with you on your leon movement…he should start…he will be our very own westbrook…
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Reprocity says:
Leon should start and TJ should come in the 4th when the D is worn down. We are not a running team which is a lot like trying to run a 3-4 with 4-3 players.
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Paul says:
I think it’ll take a little time for the O-Line to gel with their run blocking. That being said, I think they’ll be fine.
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SackDance99 says:
I think this was a classic “keep our powder dry” decision. I expect the Jets will use a lot of counters and run left behind Faneca. I don’t recall seeing a single strong right, run left. This is no surprise because the Jets will face 4 3-4 defenses right off the bat and the counter is the hardest running play to defense for a 3-4 (the NT has to shade left and should be walled off by Mangold, leaving Faneca to blow up the weakside ILB…money in the bank). With excellent run-blocking OGs and Mangold, I’m not concerned about the running game one bit.
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AL says:
I think we are making excuses. We have the worst run offense of any team in the preseason and yes it is a concern. I guess we will just have to see what happens in miami. I also don’t think maimi is going to be that bad this year. I think they win 6 or 7 games. Ricky williams looks real good in preseason.
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Leon as a starting RB? You all are crazy. He’s a scat back albeit a very good one. What happens when you let a scat back become your primary RB? See Reggie Bush last year. 20 carries a game 66 yrds rushing.
Leon Washington = a very good change of pace back
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RK says:
Jones has had 4, 2 and 6 carries in 3 preseason games. Hamstring him and leave him for the vultures! The deadbeat!
Seriously the guy gave his all last year and will be more productive this year. Damien Woody alone is a huge enough improvement on the right side but with Fancea too there is no doubt there will be holes for any back.
I too think Chatman will get a lot of looks throughout the season. He is tough and fast and has good vision and agility.
I was sorry to see Musa go but I thought he’d be one of the cuts. He looked good in some games last year but he redundant.
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Bent says: Mangini actually said the other day that they have been practising against the 3-4, and that this was the reason for their ineffectiveness against the 4-3. Fair enough (actually, all the top FBs in the league say they prefer playing against a 3-4 because it is easier for them to find their block, so this could mean Richardson will be more effective than he has been so far), BUT the Patriots are more than capable of switching to a 4-3 alignment (and even did so for the whole game against the Jets in the 2006 home opener, posting a first half shut out if I recall correctly).
When Leon was drafted I predicted he would be very popular and that everyone would clamour for him to be the starter, but that he would be better suited as a change of pace back (as the post above suggests). Turn Leon into a workhorse back and you’ll see a lot more fumbles and durability issues that you would with Jones getting the bulk of the carries. However, I do agree he does need to get more carries than last year and I also agree that if Jones doesn’t get it going in the early part of the season, someone else should get a chance. While the Jets do not have ideal run blocking personnel, Faneca and Richardson are amongst the best run-blockers at their position in the entire league, so I don’t totally agree with the comparison with the defensive system and players out of position.
If anything though, I do have minor concerns over Brick’s occasional inability to block in space assuming they will be running a more zonal system, but I have confidence that Callahan will have been working at this aspect of his game with him (and the right side – with Faneca pulling from LG – will probably be more important to the success of the running game anyway). To balance that out, my confidence is growing in his pass protection abilities from what I have seen this preseason.
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A lot of the run success of the offense is predicated on the choice of defenses between run, pass, and blitz. This is covered in an article at NFL Stats site.
I think last year we were facing run defenses due to the weak QB situation and O line, and the Jets tendency to run on first down. This year we’ll have to see how that changes with BF at QB. The addition of Keller would mean play-action passes to him would rip any run defense or blitz package.
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redd5 says:
its a concern, only becasue we haven’t seen great production in the preseason, and we were bad at it last year! but I’m pretty confident we’ll be able to run the ball..but I say that every year!
Maybe not right away, as it takes some time to get things together sometimes, but we have quality guys on the offensive line now! it *should* be one of our strengths this year.
If we get a strong ground game this year, we’ll be hard to beat!
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Harlan Lachman says:
Kewpie Doll to sack dance for observing, seeing, and then analyzing. I am impressed and hope you be right.
harlan
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ramble914 says:
Bent,
I’m not buying that excuse that they have been practicing against the 3-4, and thus were ineffective against the 4-3. They scout for each team, and put together a scout D and O that mimicks the team they will be facing each game, and that includes the preseason games.
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Bent says:
Neither am I. More gamesmanship from team Mangini, I think.
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charleyjet says:
Jones has looked slower than ever getting to the hole. I am very worried about him. Things look better when Leon or Chatman are in.
Hopefully, it’s because they’re “keeping their powder dry”.