Will the Real JETS please stand up?
After watching yet anther clunker for the JETS I am left wondering what is the real NY Jets team? Is it the team that won 5 in a row and looked to be the best team in the AFC? Or is it the Jets of the last 3 weeks that looks like it’s dead and buried?
What do you think?
Here are just some random thoughts during my lunch hour:
1. Why did Schott change his game plan after we had two great drives back to back? It seems like we are always shifting from what is working! If its not broken why are we fixing it? Happends every game.
2. Bob Sutton is terrible. The defense is so bland. No exotic blitzing, no twists, stunts or anything. I will now also assign him blame for our defense not being able to shed blocks and make tackles. Someone has to teach some technique. I am still in shock how a man with a 44-55-1 record in college can be a defensive coordinator.
3. Mangini- Please, please show a little emotion. The season is sinking and you just seem him on the sideline almost lifeless. Maybe the team is looking to you for leadership and fire. I know you try to fit the bellicheat mold, but you sir are NOT bellicheat, so show us a little more of you!
117 Responses to Will the Real JETS please stand up?
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Ed says:
Eric, look at how Mike Tomlin acts on the sideline. Take heed, azz.
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I agree with 1 and 2 but have to disagree on 3. What do you want him to do jump up and down like a madman and complain about every call? Some people stay calm so that they can focus on whats most important at that moment in time. Going crazy and yelling and screaming and hugging players has nothing to do with winning games.
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I can’t take Mangini’s demeanor anymore… It’s football, not golf… show some emotion… in his post game comments, on the sidelines… he needs to change for the better or he will be begging bill for a job
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Jetsfan21 says:
I agree…….Why are we rushing 3 and 4 on every single third down situation……I’m tired of him……Can em’………….
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nysportsguy –
you are wrong… those players need a kick in the a$$ sometimes after the way that defense was playing yesterday… play with some urgency! Even Dierdorf said it and he (unlike you) has played in the NFL… he does not motivate and it is irritating
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JustAGreenGuy says:
Didn’t Dierdorf also say that he envys people who can keep an even demeanor on the sideline?
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Mike says:
Sutton should’ve been fired after the San Fran game…
Mangini needs to put his name on this franchise on take over defensive playcalling. Show us how brilliant you really are…WE NEED BLITZ PACKAGES!!
The real defense stood up against the Rams, Cards (1st half), Pats (1st half), Buffalo (1st game and 2:00 mins left in yesterday) and the Titans. Sutton has no control over this group and I can’t believe them, who would be inspired by that guy. He’s so out of touch with today’s football anyway…Crennel will be the d-coordinator next season no matter what, mark my words.
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Liam says:
Is Kris Jenkins running on exhaust fumes? He has had endurance issues before, and is playing at a lighter weight and perhaps most importantly is taking on a different level of abuse this year as the NT in a 3-4 instead of the DT in a 4-3. Watch film of the last three games and he is not consistently creating the push he was earlier in the season. Is it possible he maxed himself out in the New England and Tennessee stretch? In particular in that Tennessee game where he made Mawae look like a rag doll? If Jenkins does not play at an all-world level, we are frankly screwed.
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annarborjetsfan says:
can someone help clear this up for me…
if the jets were to lose at seattle and baltimore were to lose against indianapolis, would the jets still control their own destiny in terms of a playoff spot? meaning, would the jets hold the tiebreaker over the ravens if the two teams were tied for the final wild card spot and the jets and ravens both won their remaining AFC game?
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subwayfare says:
While the coaching on both side of the ball is certainly worthy of some criticism, the play that had the most damaging impact on this game came from the unit overseen by perhaps the best coach on the team, Westhoff. The Jets were rolling on offense and the D had just forced a three and out, when special teams blew the coverage on the fake punt. That put the team on its heels, right when they were on the verge of taking the Bills’ will to fight away. Westhoff is a great coach but that blown play did a lot to change the momentum.
Could Mangini have done something to counter that emotional turnaround? Perhaps. I’m not with the Mangenious or Fire Everybody factions. This CS has shown the ability to motivate and put together game plans to win against the cream of the NFL crop in high pressure situations, but also to outthink themselves and lose to inferiors. Let’s hope that’s not the case next week in Seattle.
I agree that Jenkins looks to be wearing down some so I hope we can get a nice early lead against the Seahawks and rest him up for the Miami game where he’ll be needed against that team’s primary strength, Ronnie and Ricky.
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John says:
Mangini NEVER makes any halftime adjustments…even Herm Edwards made halftime adjustments!
Farve is missing WIDE OPEN widereceivers….
The Jets are playing Flat every game, can he motivate the Jets to play hard.
I feel like if the Jets get down by a TD, they are done.
David Harris is fools gold. Whenever he plays the defense plays horrible! Bring back Coleman. They played better as a unit once Harris was out.
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annarborjetsfan-
This is the most thorough AFC playoff scenario breakdown I could find. And it’s a doozy:
http://www.immaculateinning.com/2008/12/afc-playoff-scenarios.html
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Joe B. says:
Baltimore plays Dallas, not Indianapolis, and no, the Jets would not control their destiny, because Baltimore isn’t the only team in the running for the 6-seed. Either New England or Miami can get it as well.
By the way, Liam nailed it. Our season likely rests on the fitness of Kris Jenkins.
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The link I posted above should answer any playoff questions. Suffice it to say the Jets really need to win the next two.
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eddy g. says:
mangini, shottenheimer and sutton need to be duct taped and thrown in some lockers before game starts and let the offensive and defensive captians call the plays.
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swizzle81 says:
Umm, John I hope you were kidding about David Harris, you mean to tell me you would rather have Cody Spencer and David Bowens in there, cmon and which Coleman are you referring too?
I agree with point 1 and 2, not so much 3, i could care less if Mangini looked like a corpse on the sideline as long as the team wins.
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Mad Dog Mo says:
I suggest that the defense spends some time in pratice this week on the fundamentals of tackling. You can not tackle an NFL running back above the waist.
The Jets control their own destiny…win and their in. No need to waste time or breath rooting for others to lose. If the Jets can not win the next two games, it would be a wasted playoff spot to fall into their lap.
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JeffF says:
Honestly Mnagini is so far out of his league trying to be an NFL head coach. He has no clue, no leadership skills and if I have to watch him standing on the sidelines like a robot one more game I am going to blow up my TV set. He is a young man trying to be a big man by mimicing his mentor.
He wants to be Bill Belicheck but their is one big problem. He is not Bill Belicheck. He is an assiatnt coach who got hired because the owener did not want to fork out the big bucks for a true head coach. Now that the owner has shown a desire to spend money on this team maybe he will go out and get someone who can motivate.
Imagine Mike SIngletary coaching this team with Favre. The energy level would be through the roof. Instead we get Mr. let’s stay calm. And by the way this defensive coordinator is the worst I have seen in the 40 years I have been watching football. Has he ever heard of a blitz? Has he ever tried teaching some of these youg guys how to blitz and how to roll off the block to get to the QB? My God this is frustrating. I would rather have them go 2-14. At least you know what you are getting.
Anf what if they make the playoffs. Other than the Titans (that’s right the Titans who can’t pass a lick and have an imobile QB) they have no shot to beat anyone unless they truely change the way they defend the pass. This is the NFL. If you give any QB the amount of time the Jets give, they will eat you alive.
Dear Woody Johnson, there is a guy named Bill Cowher out there. Go get him. The money doesn;t matter, you are rich, it winning the game that counts! -
Harvlis says:
DRose, I think the first two drives must have been scripted. As soon as the script is over, Schott has no clue. He bogs down in the red zone and on crucial drives, all the time. His worst blunder came at the end of the game, after the Revis interception. The coaches should have known that it was going to take a first down to keep the ball and run out the clock. The play-calling at that point was attrocious. He needs to go.
Sutton, once again, has no idea of the importance of pressure. Almost every time we rushed more than four players, good things happened. If it weren’t for the blitz of Elam, the game was over. He either has no confidence in his players or he doesn’t have the ability to use them properly. I say, both.
Mangini is like a silent spectator. Maybe a deer in the headlights. You may say to me, “hey, we are 9-5″ but, we should be 12-2.
As for Favre. I saw him smiling on a botched play, early in the game. I hate that. We haven’t won in so long. I want a QB that gives a damn. When he throws it up for grabs, without seeing what the coverage is like or if the receiver has any daylight — it shows me he doesn’t care. He has the ability but, if he had a brain, he would be unstoppable. I wish Pennington had a chance with this team. I’m a fan of ball control and “brains”.
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SackDance99 says:
Is Jenkins breaking down or, what is more likely, teams are finding ways to run by bypassing him. I saw Jenkins still get a significant push, but the Buffalo RBs were getting outside and exploited some arm tackling. Also, Jenkins seems like he’s not in for as many plays as he was earlier in the season. It seems like all teams exploit his absence by running up the middle. It’s hard to sweep a team and Buffalo had a recent habit of beating the Jets in December, like when Losman, McGahee and Evans killed the Jets in 2006. Let’s see if the Jets can build on this and win next week.
Also, the Chiefs in Arrowhead are no picnic and Herm knows Chad very well. If I were a Fins fan, that Chiefs game would give me a sick feeling. Also, the Pats’ suspect pass defense will be facing a Cards team that will not want to face a second loss and limp into the playoffs. This will be a very interesting weekend for the AFC East.
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Did I really just see someone suggest Mike Singletary for coach of this team? Are you freaking kidding me? You dismiss Mangini as an assistant coach. Guess what smart guy, SINGLETARY HAS NEVER EVER BEEN A COORDINATOR IN THE NFL!!! Motivation can only get you so far. Herm was a great motivator, not a great coach. Dude wants Mike Singletary. Unreal.
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Harvlis, a 39-year old QB executing a naked bootleg isn’t an indication that he cares? Favre didn’t throw any pass yesterday up for grabs. The first INT was Coles fault, plain and simple. He “alligator-armed” the pass because he was going to get whacked. It happens, but there is no way that INT was Favre’s fault and he certainly didn’t throw it up for grabs. The second INT was a poor pass caused because he was hit as he was finishing the throw. Coles had a step on the DB and the only reason Coles seemed double-covered is because the safety was able to get over on the wobbly throw. Was that pass a mistake? With 20-20 hindsight, sure. How about the sure TD on a beautiful pass that Keller dropped (and why was the flag picked up)?
Favre doesn’t play defense and special teams. I really don’t think the offense was the culprit. 24 points should have been more than enough against a team that scored a combined 6 points in its last 2 games. And, for the record, the 372 yards given up by the Buffalo D was the 4th most that they gave up all season. Instead, the defense made the Bills look like the Kelly K-Gun-era Bills.
And, while I thought Schotty’s 3 passes called on the Jets 3-yard line were unbelievably stupid, I disagree that running after the Revis INT was a mistake, even on 4th down. Passing or trying an FG could have resulted in a turnover (remember the KC game?) and I can’t fault Schotty for doing what he should do: allow his OL and top RB the opportunity to make a play and win the game. TJ breaks a tackle and gets the 1st down and we don’t have this discussion.
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SD99, it is worth noting that there is virtually no plausible scenario in which the Jets lose to the Dolphins (even if Dolphins lose to KC) and Jets still make it in. Even assuming two losses by Pats, Jets would still lose division to Dolphins based on record v. common opponents. Jets would also lose out on wild card unless Ravens lost their last two games. If the Jets lose this weekend to Seattle, can still win division with a win over Dolphins if Pats lose either of remaining two games (we would have better in division record).
As to teams adjusting against Jenkins, yes there is some truth to that, but absent a few plays (such as the fourth and short where Jenkins had burst and the RB sideshuffled, and the late game conversion where Losman completed a pass while Jenkins took him down), there were way too many plays where Jenkins was stood up. I agree he is playing fewer plays, but I would argue that is a direct result of my concern: fatigue. He still is able to dominate at times but doesn’t seem to have enough in the tank to dominate consistently-like he did earlier in the year.
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1- Schott changed his gameplan because Favre threw a INT and he got nervous. He then went directly to the run game which was predictable.His rythym as a OC is so bad its not even funny.
2- Sutton is bad but these players are not makiing any plays. Even when we sent blitzes yesterday in the 3rd quarter Loshman completed passes. Where has Rhodes been this year?
3- I do not get why fans need Mangini to yell and scream to show he is a good football coach? There are plenty of coaches (Shannahan,Belichick,Dungy etc) that do not explode on the sidelines during bad times. Why is Mangini hung for this? It has been noted that he is an emotional coach Monday through Friday. That should be enough. -
RK says:
So far Mangini has put together what looks like 2 winning seasons as a head coach sandwiching one bad season. I think it’s pretty fair to say he is doing his job right.
Sutton is not out on the field giving up short passes on 3rd and long. I have said before that being in 3rd and long is the ideal time to blitz so I don’t understand the coverage all the time but clearly the opposition has a way to continually convert when they shouldn’t; that has been happening all year.
It’s amazing to me how fans react to a winning record. Do you all not understand that even good teams lose sometimes. It is called ANY GIVEN SUNDAY and every bookie and Las Vegas Sportsbook would tell you that nothing is a given. There are 53 men out there and some have great days, some have bad days, some are good, some are mediocre, but it is all up to them.
There are 8 teams that are 9-5 and a few other teams that are floating either one win more or less that that. The Jets are atop their division. Asking to replace the coach is ridiculous. Mangini is still green and he’s winning. Bill Cowher had 7 years as an assistant coach or coordinator before he got a head coaching job. Winning used to be good enough and now it’s not apparently.
I say the real Jets are just like any other NFL team, they try to win every week but are fallible because they are human. They have a winning record and while it hasn’t been pretty that is the real Jets right now.
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dcpackerfan says:
Harvlis: I just wanted to add that Favre cares more than we can ever know. His smile is just a way to hide his pain. I am not excusing his INT or poor pass, but I wanted you to know that it eats him up inside. He is the most competitive player I have ever seen. He cares deeply about winning and playing well.
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RK- the Jets are not “just like” any other NFL team, they are more talented then most. There are two tangible ingredients to success on the football field: (1) ability of the players; and (2) ability of the coaching staff. There are few teams in the entire NFL that can meet our talent level. On defense: Ellis + Big Jinx on the line, Pace and DHarris at LBs, Rhodes and Revis in the DB); on offense, one of the best OLs in the league, the trio of TJ, Leon and TRich in the backfield is outstanding, Favre at Qb, Coles and Cotch and Keller are weapons.
You look at the talent and good health on this team and it becomes difficult not to point a big finger at the coaching staff.
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Ben says:
Here’s the deal: The jets have great players and the coaches (particularly Sutten ) ruin it. Bring in Cowher!!!!!! Or how about this: Unite Brian Shotty with his dad……What do u guys think
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The Ed(itor) says:
I agree with all 3 points. Mangini is supposed to be a Defensive Genius. If he is such a genius, why does our “D” suck???
Mangini is over his head. Is way too conservative and plays not to lose. I agree with Mike Vacaro that the JETS need to win the next two games and if they don’t, Mangini should be fired.
http://www.nypost.com/sports/jets/jets.htm -
Pete says:
We have all the tools, we just need some direction. Sutton is horrible and shotty is all about switching things up at the wrong time. I really hope we show up for the last 2 games cause Pennington is making us look like jerk-offs……
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imstylinonem says:
im starting to see alot of you people hop off the jenkins bandwagon becuase we are getting burnt on defense. riddle me this…. who wouldnt wear down somewhat after facing double teams CONSISTENTLY ALL SEASON! Jenkins never put up big tackling numbers or sack numbers from the start of the season, he just drew so much attention that it freed up pace and bryan thomas for one on one scenarios. hampton on the steelers is a beast, but his linebackers no how to pick up the slack, in Baltimore Justin Bannan and Trevor Pryce create havoc and their linebackerts know how to pick up the slack, im not gonna throw all our linebackers under the bus because our defensive schemes and blitzing packages are by far the woooorst in NFL history by probably the woooorst defensive coordinator in NFL history. You people have to realize that when teams play us they KNOW that jenkins is the ONLY threat we have on defense, these are professional coaches and professional athlets i must say…eventually they will catch on and embedded that into their gameplan. you cant expect jenkins to dominate two 300 punders at the same time ALL the time….i hop you realize that opposing runners do most damage around the edges…not up the middle…and if they do go up the middle the center and gaurd always shade jenkins away from the path….yeah i DO believe he is getting somewhat tired but the OTHER front 6 have to step up, players like bryan thomas had a little lucky stretch at the beginning of the season and are now starting to show their true colors. im fed up!….jenkins is NOT to blame here.
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Sack, When I talk about Favre’s poor throws, it goes back for a number of games now. He has repeatedly forced the ball into coverage, without his receivers being open. He doesn’t lead the league in INT’s for nothing. When he did it, this past game, all of the announcers and the look on Mangini’s face, said “WHY?”. I am not blaming our mediocre performance on Brett but, as much as he is an American hero, he has been a part of the problem.
I agree with you – the defense forgot how to tackle and, once again, didn’t put on the pressure or go for the throat.
As for the play calling after the Revis interception, there is nothing wrong with running the ball at that time, to eliminate mistakes. To not have any misdirection, movement in the backfield, or trickery, at that time is inexcusable. If we get the first down — we win and they don’t get the ball. At that point, Bill Parcells would have made the play calls that would have ended the game. Game over. That is what a good coach does. A good coach does not let them get the ball back. It is about control of the ball and the clock.
RK, Mangini is reminding me of Davey Johnson for the Mets. Yeah, he won a championship but, he should have won three! What you have to ask yourself is, are we playing up to our potential.
If you are watching what I am watching, you can’t come to that conclusion. We have the players to be dominant. Our coaching staff is what is holding us back. It comes down to play-calling on both sides of the ball. I am not second guessing. On defense, to rush four players, against mediocre QB’s and have them look like Joe Montana against us, on a regular basis, is a problem with coaching. Our Offensive play-calling is Offensive. Schottenheimer forgot about Cotchery and Coles for two weeks straight. Fans, on this blog, were saying that they can’t get open. Then, as soon as they go back to them — they make one big play after another. Leon breaks huge runs. How many times a game has he gotten the ball. TJ can’t be stopped. How many times have they gone away from him. Keller drops his first pass, last game, and they stop feeding him the ball. That is why we looked ugly winning.
By the way, Herm Edwards had two years of 10-6 and one year of 9-7 record. His record in the playoffs was 2-3. Imagine if we had a coach, during those years.
Face it folks, we got lucky. We shouldn’t have to get lucky. We should be crushing teams like the Raiders, the Niners and the Bills. I would love post positive comments but, when I see something that makes me sick, I have to speak up.
Now, let’s hope the coaches wise up, we crush the Seahawks and the Fish, and make some noise in the playoffs.
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Its sooo simple jets fans: Get Cowher!!
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My only point with David Harris is that they were playing better when he wasn’t playing. It may not necessarily be all his fault, but the numbers speak for themselves.
Who needs a screamer? We just need someone who knows how to motivate players and make some adjustments, after 3 games, I am still waiting….
Singletary is not just a motivator, he is actually a very smart coach. I watched an ESPN special on him last year and he was very knowledgeable, at least on the defensive aspect of the game. He has Martz for the offense.
Cowher is so conservative. I don’t know about him.
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John,
Who cares is cowher is conservative, he wins football games. Id rather have any of cowhers “conservative’ steelers teams than our “not conservative” jets. The main difference: passion and energy -
Harvlis- On their catches they weren’t open by all that much. I still don’t think they can get consistant good seperation. Good pitch and catch on the Cotchery touchdown. Coles had a decent game but he still wasn’t very open. Just open by NFL WR standards.
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Liam by your flawed reasoning the Pats should have won the bowl last year…they didn’t. They Cowboys and Packers should have beaten the Giants…they didn’t.
Saying a team is good on paper has about as much worth as used paper…toilet paper that is.
Last year I think the Cowboys sent more players to the Probowl than any other team (not certain on that) so shouldn’t they have won the Super Bowl? I mean they have the better players right?
We are 15 games into the season. Players, regardless of ability, get injured, tired, have personal issues, life gets in the way of anyone and their career sometimes. That goes for coaches too. They can’t predict the game plan of their opponent or their desire. The will of the other team and will, while intangible, often dictates the outcome of a game.
You can say the Jets are all Probowlers but that doesn’t mean they will win. It usually does but not week to week.
Granted like every other fan winning convincingly is the best way to win but because of the parity in the league I’d like our chances against most teams head to head in a playoff game. That is what matters.
Some of you are afraid to go into the playoffs; I say “Bring it!”
I bet there is no team in the AFC that want to face the Jets at all come playoff time. That should be the measuring stick not a bunch of fans that think the coaching or players are flawed or talented.
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Herm was a decent coach, who drove you nuts with some of his play calls and game management, but he was not Richie Kotite. He was definitely no Parcells, but he was just some where in the middle.
The sad thing is, is that if Doug Brien hits a fg in Pittsburgh, Herm would have been just the fourth coach in Jets history to make it to the AFC Championship game. If Abraham plays in that game at Pittsburgh maybe it is different, but the guy couldn’t stay healthy.
Anyway, at this point Mangini’s team looks like they don’t want to play for him. I saw on Inside the NFL like three weeks ago that players around the league rated Mangini as one of the top 5 worst coaches to work for.
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matt says:
to congratualate mangini on two winning seasons is a joke…. they had a light schedule this year and have dropped three games they should of dominated (oakland denver, san fran) and barely won buffalo due to buff’s mistakes at the end……… I haven’t even heard mangini say anything about the lack of pass rush….does he realize its a problem? or is he moronic…. He has been outcoached in to many games…. they picked up some good players they should be destroying some of these teams… I watched the first game of the year he sat on the ball in the fourth quarter with the lead… then went to the prevent against chad showing no pressure. chad drove down and almost beat him….He is not aggressive guy he should not be head coach….. sutton probably a nice guy but he is just awful…. if you don’t pressure the qb you will not win….
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I was at the Bills game, the wrs were open all over the field. Farve just did not see them or get them the ball. Perfect example was when Farve under threw Cotchery. Cotchery was WIDE OPEN. He should have hit him in stride. It would have been a TD.
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I don’t know about the 49ers game. Was at the Denver game, but it was a horrible weather game and the Broncos kept mysteriously getting injured….
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havent the same feelings as all those on the website… they are not calling enough blitzers and even commentators… you know the players in the lockerroom have to be questioning his skills as a head coach…. not a motivator. He is costing this team not the talent…. look at the steelers they are an attacking defense…. even when they don’t get to the qb the qb makes mistakes because 7 out of the last passes he got pressured…
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EddieC says:
saw a highlight of the dolphins game- with Pennington screaming at his team on the sidelines to get their heads back in the game…hmmm we need that
heard Kerry Rhodes on espn’s first take- and his compliments to how well the defense has been playing…really?? regardless of HOW many turnovers we got we were embarrassed yesterday.
“I don’t believe in lucky wins”- Kerry Rhodes
…after yesterday- I DO
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Agreed. Yesterday, the Jets go lucky for a chance. Cimini’s article in the Daily News is funny. He compares it to the Giants/Eagles fumble in the meadowlands when Herm picks up that ball and runs it into the endzone.
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I didn’t congratulate Mangini I said he is doing his job by winning. Of course all of you want the best coach, the best players, the most flawless games; who wouldn’t?
Name a team that doesn’t have a loss they “should have won.”
I guess I have to repeat “Any given Sunday.”
The bounce of a ball, a refs call, light in your eyes, a dropped pass, there are literally innumerable possibilities during a game that impact the outcome. You still have to win and Mangini still is winning.
I’m sure everyone knows better than he and the other coaches do and as proof you are all on here blogging part time from your NFL coaching jobs.
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Be careful what you wish for…
With Cowher doesn’t come Lebeau who was his D coordinator and is currently in charge of the consensus #1 defense in football. Any buddy would look great with a D coordinator like that.
4-1 division record and you guys are ready to kill a coach. When was the last time we could go 5-1 in the division? Blame Mangini for not grooming a QB, but don’t write about how he doesn’t make adjustments. If you watch the game you see them.
We will see tho and most likely if the team follows the advice of this blog I will never see a Jet superbowl.
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This team is a very similar team on paper to the 98 team. The differnece: We had parcells then and we have mangini now. We had bilichek then, we habe sutton now. We need Coehwer and if not, get rex ryan from baltimore. He’ll blitz once in a while
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What adjustments. Like rushing 3 people against the Pats in the final drive of the half. Yesterday, they got lucky.
When is the last time you have seen the Jets down by a TD or more come back and actually win a game under Mangini. Like NEVER. The guys teams either come out and win or they come out and lose. Did you believe that that they were going to win in San Fran once they were down, I did not.
I was stupid enough to think that they would win against Denver, but that didn’t happen either….
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i hope those fictious injuries the dbs(den) were getting is looked into by the league . it was overdone shanahan should be spoken to by the league… if a team pulled that nonsense with him he would of cried
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I do agree about Cowher though. I don’t LOVE him, but who else is out there? I don’t want Mike Holmgren, that is for sure.
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BTW the Jets were still 5th in the league in rushing D and tied 4th for sacks with the Giants (as per NFL.com).
It is their pass D that has been their Achilles heel and you can’t make Lowery, Law, Coleman, Smith, Elam et al play better than they are and you can’t make the LBs faster in coverage than they are. You may blitz, and like I said I would expect more, but that doesn’t mean you won’t get beaten if your DBs and LBs can’t cover.
And I agree about Rhodes. I know where Hollywood is and it’s not in NY lately.
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kc. says:
FIRST of all,David Harris is NOT to blame for the defense and we DO NOT play better when he’s not in there! He JUST came back TWO weeks ago and in BOTH those games LED the TEAM in tackles…..13 tackles and half a sack in FIRST game back and 11 tackles LAST game….while EVERYONE is DOUBLE TEAMING JINX,Harris is the ONLY other one on D who is doing what they are SUPPOSED to do!
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John,
What dont u love about cowher. Hes a passionate, in-your face, and above all WINNING coach. We need someone to give us that identity that we had when parcells was here. Even Marty Shottenheimer sounds good. Or perhaps Rex ryan from baltimore -
Eddie C, Great point about Pennington on the Dolphin sideline. You have to love seeing that. That is why, I have always liked Chad. He may not be Hall of Fame but, he is classy and he is a winner. I hope our Defense is smart enough to put the pressure on him otherwise, he is going to put a hurting on our season.
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RK,
The sacks number is misleading. Most of them vame in beginning if season when secondary was playing well, and they were coverage sacks. And alot of them came from blitzes which Grandpa Sutton doesnt do anymore -
No but they did switch coverage patterns in the second half of that game. They did get lucky yesterday. They also produced more sacks and turnovers in the second half. Two turnovers were because of desperation I will admit. We did get lucky, but we didn’t against Oakland and we got a BS call against the 49ers. I’ll take a little luck on our side and it isn’t about making adjustments it is about making the right ones.
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I feel like Cowher got lucky to win the Superbowl that he did. Yes, he has fire and he is a decent coach, but after watching Cowher for a number of years, his clock management resembles Herman Edwards. He would screw it up royaly and he super conservative. Schottenheimer can’t win in the playoffs. DO NOT WANT HIM.
Rex Ryan actually is a brillant suggestion. I like him.
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I won’t argue about Cowher as his record speaks for itself but I will say that never in Pittsburgh’s history has the team had 2 back to back seasons of 10 or more losses.
Pittsburgh is a special football town with a special family that has owned the team since the beginning. The whole area raises football players like our boy Revis.
I will say that Cowher was lucky to coach there and leave it at that.
And to point out, they are still winning without him Cowher. Tomlin was 10-6 last year; Cowher’s last year they were 8-8.
Also, they have Steely McBeam. -
Jets D with or without Harris, Cimini broke the numbers down a before Harris came back (and I did mean bring back Bowens not Coleman, sorry):
“• Barring a setback in practice, ILB David Harris probably will be back in uniform. Harris, out the last five games due to groin surgery, has made significant progress, according to Dr. Mangini. Presumably, Harris will start, although there’s a chance he’ll be rotating with Jason Trusnik, who has split time in that spot with David Bowens and Cody Spencer. Methinks Bowens will go back to his role as a situational rusher, where he’s more effective.
By the way, here’s a breakdown of the Jets’ rushing defense, with and without Harris:
Yds/Game/Avg./TD
With Harris: 82.6/3.2/7
Without Harris: 81.4/4.1/1″This is only the rushing defense. They allowed 9 TDs with Harris in, as opposed to 2 TDs when he was gone.
I was watching Harris earlier in the season and he is not good in space, covering the back out of the back field, but I have to be honest I have not focused on him the last two games so I don’t know. What I do know is that the numbers show that when he plays, the Jets D is not as good.
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Fine even without cowher we could bring in a parcells like coach who can change the identity of the jets to a tough physical team like the steelers and revens. I think marty shottenheimer will be good (look at the chargers with him and without him) and rex ryan would also bring toughness. I wouldnt want steve spagnola. He wouldnt bring that tough identity
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I can’t really explain the numbers, but perhaps, Harris was playing hurt earlier in the year, but that does not change the fact that their record without him is pretty damn good.
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at least this year it is….
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Don’t you want to win a superbowl in your life time? Schot is an AWFUL playoff coach who was outcoached by Herman Edwards. He is too conservative as well. He is a great regular season coach, but can’t coach his way out of a paper bag in the playoffs. I would rather have Cowher than Schot.
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every team blows a game against an inferior team… but three and probably one more to come… and a lucky win over the bills.. come on…..its seems they have the talent to better and they have been flat as of late…. who do you blame…. rushing three or four isn’t getting it done… mangini may not be a bad techinician as far as dbs or any position…… but his overall scheme for defense is weak.. the frustation is the lack of adjustment… even in the second half of th pats game they put no pressure on the qb…. its like watching a character in a horror movie….going into the room where the killer is waiting…. no pressure on qbs u are dead in this league
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southfloridajetsfan says:
The defensive play that stood out to me was a 3rd down inside the red zone prior to the ridiculous TD run…
It was a short slant and the receiver had to tap it up with one hand before grabbing it out of the air to pick up the first down…
Kerry Rhodes had a free shot to level the guy and seperate him from any chances of making the catch and he looked SCARED TO MAKE THE HIT!!!
He more than anything else is the biggest shock to me…The guy has turned soft. Can you imagine Polamalu on a similar play. The WR would be carted off the field and the FG unit would come out for 3 points…
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southfloridajetsfan,
I remember that play and thought the same thing. That would happen with a good tough coach -
brian311 says:
i think we have our hands full next week, but week 17 vs the dolphins absolutely TERRIFIES me. one thing you cannot do with chad is let him sit back in a lawn chair and survey the field. we cannot cover slot WRs, TEs or releasing RBs, he no doubt knows this and will abolsutely pick us apart – waiting for his primary receivers (ginn, etc) to get down fireld and move to his checkdowns
the staff should use this week as the opportunity to come at the QB with wreckless abandonment. if we cant get to sennica wallace (the ‘hawks will be on their 3rd left tackle, by the way) there is no way we are going to hurry chad. chad will not make a mistake if there is no pressure – this is a lock.
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Najy says:
Here is why our run D has dropped off…
-The lack of pass rush
-The lack of ability to sustain long drives on Offesne eventually tires out the D.
-The lack of ability to get off hte field on 3rd down on D.
-Not scoring enough points on O. We can make teams one dimensional once we go up by 14 points. Not happening lately.
-Offense turning the ball over.Yes, football is an emotoinal sport but the coaches get paid to coach… Not be emotional. I really dont like Sutton too much and I am not a big fan of Schotty.
Mangini is diong a good job for a young coach and has his team in a positoin to make a run at the playoffs… Even make a run in the playoffs. I wouldnt be too worried… We won the game and thats all that matters.
Coaching is what Mangini does and he is a very smart, calculating coach… He knows what he is doing and he is very consistent. We are 2 games away from clinching the division, making the playoffs, and having a home game and you guys are still b*itching…
When was the last time we were in this situation?
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Ducky says:
Does anyone know how the defensive game plans are set? Who designs the system? Who draws up and calls the plays? Can Mangini override the calls?
I am interested in who bears the responsibility for the defense as it is called, because it seems like that is where the problems lie. -
Under Herm Edwards.
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It boils down to the head coach. mangini can do whatever he wants, but he typically does not take play calling responsibility away from Sutton. He leaves it up to Sutton. It is Mangini’s responsibility.
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John,
Yeah… 6 years ago! Exactly my point.
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Najy agree with the majority of what you said, but the team should have lost that game yesterday. Mangini has to do better. Yes, he is a decent coach, but we want a superbowl!. Most of us probably weren’t alive the last time the Jets played in one.
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I am 23 years old so I def wasnt alive for that… Sometimes, you get a lucky break here and there.. Whats the big deal? Why cant you just except that we won. Would you rather that we lost?
Good teams usually win games that they are suppose to lose.. Thats what makes them good. When you are not dominant and you make every mistake that you can to lose the game… AND you still win.. That is special.
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LMPCPA23 says:
When the defense has to come out on the field every time the offense goes 3 and out and no sustained drives, I would be tired too. Did anyone else notice that when the Jets came out of the tunnel the defense just walked over and lined up to meet the offense? There was no absolutely no energy. I wish Mangini would show some emotion too! Wake up!
Who would’ve thought a pass rush would actually work? The Jets won that game because of one lucky play. Otherwise all was lost at that point.
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Frank says:
Didnt Eric Mangini just beat a division opponent and sweep the series. Reading there posts, it seems like the Jets have no shot and they are not a good team. And why are we criticizing his attitude on the sideline. He has this team at 9-5 and fans are still not happy. Also, i like the move to go for it on 4th down. 4th and 2, 1:20 left. Bills 0 timeouts….gotta go for the W. plus losman is not exactly Peyton Manning. if he gets the 1st down, nobody is talkin bout it right now
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MattV says:
James Ihedigbo needs to go, period.
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Fire Sutton! says:
This team did not dserve to win yesterday..period. If it was not for a bad play call on Buffalo’s part, we are out of first place and on the outside looking in for the playoffs. Sugar coat it however you like, it’s the painful truth.
This team looked amazing in the first quarter and after one bad luck interception, the whole ship came apart. Secondary looks awful again, no pressure on the opposing teams QB and what was up with the special teams??? Sutton looks lost.
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BubbyBrister/shovelpass says:
I agree about Kerry Rhodes looking meek on that play. Also, did you see that he can’t even chase down JP Losman?
Sometimes I want to change the Joe Dimaggio part of that Simon and Garfunkle song and insert Kerry Rhodes …(goo-goo-ka-choo)
Damn, Kerry, why have you forsaken us?
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FreemanMcNeil says:
Take care of Seattle by pounding the run game right at them. Then, we have a date with Mr. Pennington and the Tuna Fish. A Sunday night fish fry.
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Mike G says:
First of all for quite some time I had been blaming Chad for the way our offense was playing… Sorry Chad… Obviously it wasn’t all your fault.
Secondly Sutton is either blind or an idiot I just can’t make up my mind.
Thirdly the HC has to take blame for letting the OC and the DC continually make very bad calls consistently. I hate to say it but aside from one game it seems to be the one thing they (Coaches) do consistentley.
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P.S. Even if buy some fluke we were to win the Superbowl I would still stand by these words just like yesterdays win was a fluke.
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jas says:
We are all hoping for the playoffs. The only problem is that unless we miss the playoffs we are stuck with these idiots for another year or two.
Plain and simple, this team does not play well week after week and it is not the talent. Beli is down to his 10th LB and 10th DB and they still play well. We have had almost no injuries to key guys.
Bad schemes, bad play calling and bad game plans.
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Amen
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Last time I checked Mangini is still the coach, so this notion of Cowher coming in and being a savior next year is ridiculous. Let the season play out and if the Jets do not make the playoffs I agree that the HC position needs to be looked at and at the very least the D Coord. and O Coord definitely need to go, but till we get to that point, let the season play itself out, as painful as it might be. Ssssh the Jets are still in first by the way.
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ja says:
jas said it
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Sean says:
Sutton must go. Did anyone see how the giants and boys were attacking eachother’s QB all night. We have way too much talent on D to be this bad.
However, can you really blame the coaches for the poor tackling? These guys are professionals and know that part of their job it to tackle. I can appreciate that the LBs and DEs need some coaching in technique of shedding blockers and reading blocking schemes but not tackling. Tackling is the most fundamental aspect of playing defense.
Cleveland can keep Crennel. I do not know much about him but I do not want to bring in another defensive guy who was only successful under Belichek. It is more likely that Belichek was the reason for their success rather than the other way around.
I wish Crennel success but I dont want to give another Belichek guy a CHANCE.
Let’s bring in someone who has a proven record of success on their own and not because their mentor is the best defensive mind the NFL has ever seen.
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Charles Parkhurst says:
Why is that no one is talking about the 3 punts into the endzone from midfield or closer the last 2 weeks? Not even trying for the coffin corner! Mangini acts like he has accomplishments to protect. He hasn’t done a thing. He should be taking a few chances.
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You know why Mangini has a sour look on his puss when things go wrong?
A. He doesn’t know how to stop the bleeding.
B. His “Dad” is not around anymore to tell him how to stop the bleeding.Hate to say it Jet fans but just like we were waiting for Herm to learn how to be a HC now were waiting for Mangini to do the same…
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Charlie, I have brought this up recently. It is coaching. It doesn’t take a special punter to angle his body and the ball towards the corner. It takes a coach to tell him to do it. As almost everyone on this blog agrees — we have no coaching.
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Thank you Harvelis.
We have no coaching.
Brutal-week after week.
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Brad says:
What are the chances that Sutton is fired in the offseason and Romeo Crennel is brought in? Sutton is terrible.
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Hangar says:
Sean
Is it not the coach who tells them tackling is to wrap up and not just trying to pull the ball out. Watch these guys they are all trying to get the ball out when the runner is still getting yards. How about getting low and wraping up…Crennel…why, I agree better than “I don’t know a thing Sutton but Crennel?
Just win Sunday..
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Romeo Crennel says:
whats that? you guys are looking for a DC? Ill send the water boy my resume.
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ALL ABOARD!!!
Forget Crennel, I’m still riding the Rob Ryan train, have been for 2 seasons now.
NEXT STOP NEW YORK.
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junior says:
????????? is Rob Ryan fluent in a 3-4 defense if he has even the least of experience he is still an upgrade over sutton dont know much about ryan any defensive numbers???
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you sure seem confused there jr.
Ryan worked with the NE defense from ’00 to ’03. He also kept the Raiders D in the top 5 in ’06.Oh yeah I think he helped NE win 2 super-bowls in his tenure there.
He currently runs a 4-3 (**cough cough, al davis, cough cough**)
I think he knows the 3-4 better than a coach who tenured with Western Michigan, Syracuse and Army.
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i just didnt know about him thanks for the info
I would like crennell though i think he would be fantastic here -
Joe S says:
Im sorry but i guess im the only happy Jet fan alive. This team was 4-12 last year. Ask yourselves this when thinking about the Jets if before the year started someone told you that going into week 16 the Jets would be 9-5 and control their own destiny in the division you wouldn’t be happy? C’mon get real guys who cares how theywin as long as they win, if that was the Superbowl yesterday you be thrilled that they won and could care less how they did it. Winning is winning. 9-5 and still in control sounds good to me.
Just be happy that their in position to win this division. Since when did the Jets become this great team with a history of winning that we can complain how they win? Newsflash we normally suck and are fighting for a wildcard at best during this part of the season not a division title. Take it for what it is!
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One of you guys please explain to me how we were able to:
-Beat the undefeated Titans at home.
-Beat the “well coached” Patriots at home.
-Go on a 5 game win streak
-(4-1) in the AFC East
-Leading the division
-In control of our own destiny to make the playoffs.
-(9-5) Overall recordOne of you football guru’s provide me with an explanation for this… How is this bad coaching and what would you like to do different… Aside from whining about being in 1st place.
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I am only 23 years old and have been a Jets fan since 1998. I probably havent seen as much of Jets football as some of the fans on this blog, so I may not understand the pessimism..
Jets have one of the worst histories in football and a lot of you have probably witnessed most of the games. You guys might not know what its like to have a winning team.
I will tell you one thing… Winning teams arent always pretty and perfect. Tenn is rattled, Giants dropped 2 in a row, Dallas is fighing back after a tough season… My point is there will always be adversity and players and fans need to keep the faith…
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Najy- go get the DVD of the Walton, Coslett, and Kotite eras. Then you will understand. It comes complete with a courderoy “script” JETS hat to throw at the TV, and a Kenny O’ jersey to wipe your tears with.
’98 was a good year to become a JETS fan.
Watch the film, you’ll get a feel for the comments a ‘lil better.
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The problem is consistency
show some the only thing they do consistent is have that same outer space look. I actually give schotty a pass but Sutton is not a good coach not even talking about x’s and o’s but how come gholston isnt playing well why do they not tackle well they bring in retreads in the secondary every other week i mean serious sutton is just bad -
WE NEED A BLITZ CONSULTANT ON OUR TEAM. MAYBE WE CAN GET MIKE DITKA TO SIT UPSTAIRS AND CALL BLITZ OR BLITZ PACKAGES AND STUNTS. IS THERE ANYONE OUT THERE? HOW ABOUT SCHOTTY SR?
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cbiscuit says:
This team peaked after the TEN game and has been handled every week since for one simple reason – execution. You can blame the coaches all you want (and I agree the defensive play calling is way conservative), but if the players play to their capability we will be fine. This includes the secondary, the receivers, the punter (c’mon he sucks) and even Brett the great – who has looked really ordinary the last 3 weeks.
All that matters is next week. Suck it up and get it done boys!
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Chrebookie,
I am sure you have every reason to feel like this… I just dont see the point of jumping the ship before the boat has sank..
Next year is a loooonnggg time away… I would hate to have to look forward to next year before this year is over. Lets give them a chance.. I have faith in these guys, but I do agree that something needs to be done about Sutton and Schotty.
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Fonz says:
WAY TO GO REVIS AND ELAM!!!
YOU GUYS RETURNED THE FAVOR TO LOSMAN!!!
IT WAS LAST YEAR WHEN YOU GUYS COLLIDED AND GAVE THE BILLS THE GO AHEAD TOUCHDOWN TO FINISH THE GAME!!!!
GREAT WAY TO RETURN THE FAVOR WITH BACK TO BACK TURNOVERS!!!!!!
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Robert Mueller says:
To John who complains about Favre missing wide open receivers. Favre has always missed wide open receivers. Also, Favre does not always win the big games. You win some, you lose some with Favre. Only a very few quarterbacks in history won nearly all the big games. So I think you cannot expect Favre to carry the team, but rather to do what he has already done, help them to have a chance.
There were a few games with the Packers where Favre willed them to victory and it was a beautiful thing to watch. But in some of the other important games he did not pull it off. -
Geoff says:
Just beat Seattle.
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section133 says:
Its obvious that since losing to Denver the team has lost its way. In the press conference after the bills game mangini was amazed as everyone else that we pulled the win off.
Simply put the team is LOST right now.
Mangini needs to step up, show some emotion and lead this team!!!
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TruJetFan says:
Reminder. WE ARE STILL IN FIRST PLACE AND IN CONTROL OF OUR PLAYOFF FATE. I understand we look shaky in some areas and there is cause for concern. But, c’mon. If we kick ass in Seattle this Sunday, everyone on this blog will change their tune instantaneously. And is that a good thing?
Could it be possible that we are a team that wins and performs when it has too? Could it be that that is what Bret Favre has brought to this team? If we win the next two games, we will have defined ourselves as that kind of team. As division champs no one can take it away from us.
All I can say at week 16 is GO JETS. BEAT SEATTLE AND BEAT THE FISH. No complaints.
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I think the difference between an ordinary coach and a great one is the differnece beteween the jets now and the jets being a super bowl team. Bring in Cowher or Marty Shottenheimer no matter the cost.
And this whole thing Marty cant win a super bowl is bs. He’s a great coach. Just look at san diego with him and without him. But cowher would be better
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cbiscuit says:
Dude – wake up please. This FO is comfortable with this coaching staff and wants continuity. Knee jerk hiring/firing big name coaches ain’t the answer. Marty doesn’t want back in. If he did, and the Jets got him, do you think he would really do that much to change the O (coached by his son) or the special teams? No. As for the D – how does Gunther Cunningham sound? Cowher is happy and would want no part of NY without total control, and that ain’t gonna happen. In either case, a big coaching change sets us back another 2 years. We have a system and we have a plan which is light years away from ‘same old Jets’. We all need to be patient and let it work.
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Gunther Cuningham doesnt really sound good to me. Much rather have Rob Ryan. Or if marvin lewis gets canned…..
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Bags says:
Joe S: I’m with you Bro! I’m a long time Packer fan (still am, but pray that Ted Thompson gets the ax for his ego and mismanagement of the Pack) and the Jets are my new found AFC team, with my boy Brett at the helm. As a whole, I’ve never seen such whiny fans as the majority of the Jet Blog fans. We need a little positive ju-ju and get behind the Gang Green to continue to win! Way to find a way to win!!!!
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To TruJetFan, you are correct, but not in saying that Favre “was brought in to do this”. The Packers did not win the division or the NFC championship every year, though they performed very, very well and consistently over a number of years. Favre was brought in to improve the team, not to carry the team in the way you think he will. He can “will” the team to victory, but the opponent, for example, will have something to say about it whether this time he and the Jets succeed.
sutton sucks………… pathetic and yes…. mangini you look like a statue