Eric Mangini Fired From Head Coach Job
SNY has learned that Eric Mangini is out as the Head Coach of the Jets. Woody Johnson and Mike Tannenbaum will meet with the press at 10AM.
My initial reaction to this? I don’t know if I like this move. Brian Schottenheimer and Bob Sutton’s playcalling is enough to see that Mangini has made and allowed bad decisions to continue, and might warrant his firing alone. Yes, I am a Mangini fan, but Woody and Tannenbaum were the ones who pushed for Favre, not Mangini. Favre was one of the biggest single reasons for the collapse of this team and although Mangini might not have responded properly to the season going down the drain, firing him is the symptom, not the cause. It’s a cheap save your bacon move by Tannenbaum. If this firing is coupled with the Jets’ retention of Brett Favre this offseason, buckle yourself in for a hellish next five years.
We’ll find out more at 10AM …
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I see where you’re coming from Bassett, but IMO, Tannenbaum’s overall body of work is greater than Mangini’s. It’s too easy to sit back after the fact and say that bringing in Favre was a mistake. There’s no crystal ball and the decision was made based on the previous seasons of Favre and Pennington. Sure, they wanted to justify the PSL’s too. At 8-3, absolutely nobody was complaining and nobody saw the Jets collapse coming.
Bassett, I posted this on the previous thread, but I think the firing of Mangini might be directly related to Favre coming back. One of my buddies at work just predicted that Favre, with a new coach next year, would lead the boys to the playoffs and throw for 28 touchdowns to 10 picks. Frankly, I don’t see it.
I am in favor of the move. Not because I think he was at fault (even though some of the blame is his), but because we need a new attitude in the locker room.
Looking at the bench during that fins game depressed me. The team had no heart. They looked broken. they had no faith their coach would find a way to win a close game. I think Mangini has lost the team.
Maybe they simply had a cellphone and knew that the game was meaningless. Everyone in the stands did.
Listen i think Mangini is a bright dude, who in his first season knew exactly what our team was (not talented, hardworking) and schemed each game accordingly to our strengths. Over the last two years, the week to week game planning was just poor. It looked like we never had a plan sans a few games (tennessee).
There is only one Bellicheck. So if you are not game planning and you are not inspiring (i.e. Herm) then what are you ?
Unemployed
This move had to be made, and I disagree with cause/symptom analogy. A coach needs to earn his stripes in situations where the team is floundering – and coach his way out of it. Didn’t happen here, despite a very favorable schedule down the stretch.
Now there is more time for the team’s FO to start a search for the next big HC.
As for Favre – where do we send $$$ to buy his ticket back to Mississippi?
i dont know if this is the right move… do you guys honestly feel, outside of cowher, that a spagnolo, billick or rex ryan type would be better for our team… if cowher says no weve basically taken a downgrade in coaching imo
Mangini HAD to have had a major say in the Favre acquisition. Remember, it took him 2 months to name Chad starter after ‘06 and it was still a challenge between him and Clemens back in August. Either way, I’m not buying a PSL.
When the head coach is fired, and a new regime is started, it often takes a couple of years to adjust. The Jets might find themselves rebuilding the next couple of years, which will be a total waste of the talent that is present on today’s roster.
I am also very concerned about this move b/c other than Cower, I am unaware of any decent coaching candidates. Combined with the fact that there will be more than 10 head coaching vacancies this year, the Jets will have a lot of trouble finding a decent replacement for Mangini.
Nothing can rescue this inept, amateurish organization. 48 years (Titans and Jets, less ‘69) of utter incompetence. Look at the Steelers and Giants for example. They weather their ups and downs yet eventually land on their feet. Cowher left, yet the Steelers continue winning. Coughlin and Jerry Reese have built a powerful NYG team.
Big mistake…..Everyone will clamor for Cowher, He is not coming here with Mr T already in place. We will then here all fans cry for Spags from the Giants. Isnt that the same thing we did when we hired Mangini? Hired a young DC from a winning program? This is the one time the owner shouldnt have listened to the fans. The problem was Favre since week 11
i generally agree with your sentiments about tannenbaum, but i think you’re being a bit soft on mangini. primarily, he deserves heat for end of game prevent defense and lack of pass rush in key spots–even if he’s not the d-coordinator, he is a defensive guy and should have some input.
Jay- In 2006 Mangini had an open competition 4 every position and had a QB coming off of a torn rotators cuff. He named Chad the starter right after the 2006 season for the 2007 season. That camp led to Cotchery’s promotion. Come on
Mangini benched Pennington last year. He was as much to blame for not having Chad back as anyone.
Tannenbaum has had a great three years. Our last GM drafted a kicker with his first pick the year before Mr. T. Tannenbaum got Leon in the 4th round and traded up for Revis and Harris. Also drafted Brick, Mangold and Keller. Favre was high risk/high reward, but was not a poor move at the time. He gets another chance. Mangini was terrible in many ways since his first great season, which probably went to his head.
What did him was the awful record against the two worse divisions, the NFC and AFC Wests, in football. They had better talent on their roster than the Bills and Dolphins and yet managed to only go 3-5 against those teams while the Bills went 6-2 and the Dolphins went 7-1. Match the Bills and you win the division. That come down to poor preparation and coaching and that falls on the coach.
Here we go again.. time to start all over. I dont know if I agree with this move. It is going to be interesting to see who they bring in.
I also hope we send Favre on his way too.. he is terrible and had as much to do with collapse as Mangini did.
I like Mangini, but he’s not the coach that’s going to take the Jets to the Super Bowl.
Tannenbaum needs to go as well, for the Favre acquisition if nothing else. I said getting Favre was a mistake at the time because at best this was a 10-6 team that would lose in the first round, and they didn’t even do that. I would much rather have just let Clemens play so we could see what he could do. Instead, we missed the playoffs and still have no idea if we need a QB. Of course, getting Favre could’ve been because they don’t think Clemens can play, but the cynic in me can’t help thinking it was just a PR move to sell PSLs.
I agree that a lateral move to another young HC seems bad, but we know what we have with Eric, and I (and many others) have seen enough to know that he will not be successful in this run. His next job, one day, perhaps he is better. After the instant success of three of the four first-year HCs this past season, it’s a risk I am willing to take.
I’d throw a ton of cash at Cowher, hoping the PSLs that it results in pay for him.
wow…i’m so fed up with this organization…every 2-3 years they’re making changes…now we get to enjoy another 2 years of “rebuilding”….
Good point Seanmac…even so, this team did not seem to be behind him.
One more thing that really pissed me off during the post game press conferences was Favre’s and Cole’s reaction to the loss. All they talked about was how much fun they had and the relationships they made in the locker room. They did not even give a **** about the loss.
You are a professional football player making millions of dollars a year. I could care less if you had fun. Your JOB is to win football games, not take warm showers with the other players!!!!
Don’t get me started on the speech that Favre gave the team huddle before the game. It boiled down to “If we win, great. If we don’t, so what.”
This may not seem relevant to the HC, but the HC’s attitude trickles down throughout the team. Could you picture Pat’s players making comments like that after a game? I can’t.
i’m very worried that they will bring in a coach who prefers the 4-3 and we will be back at ground zero with the defense. in my dream world, wade phillips gets fired and we bring him in as defensive coordinator. but in reality we will probably get some tampa two type coach who wants small quick lineman and linebackers.
Chad played horribley last year and was injured. He should have been benched. He lost 3 2nd half leads with interceptions. Do you think Mangini wanted the league leader in INTs? Of course he wanted a QB who had an arm, we all did, but a man that conservative wouldn’t want a gambler. The PSLs will be payed and we keep a bad team. Go Jets.
JustAGreenGuy – it was no secret that Mangini was not a Pennington fan and regardless of injury, the guy was worth more with a clipboard on the sideline than one year with Favre. That poor decision combined with losing this locker room sealed his fate.
I can’t understand all the people on here who would rather keep a bad coach to remain stable, when all the rookie HCs were so successful this year. Let’s take a chance at getting a good coach. This one was awful. Leon Washington got one touch in a snowy road game. One touch. That was enough to get him fired alone.
Unfortunately Mangini has to take the fall here. He’s a good and smart guy, but he could not handle a QB that was bigger than the game and certainly bigger than the coach. Management put him in a very tough spot and he failed the very difficult test.
He’ll show up again somewhere.
Now please CUT Favre.
thanks KD….u have posted that comment before…and people obviously needed to be reminded of it.
i am not exactly CELEBRATING this move….i think mangini is a good coach, his coordinators were brutal…..but his DECISIONS….HIS DECISIONS…… hello….calls that HE MADE…..4th and inches kids….
prove he might be in over his head right now. there was alot of pressure with favre….but this wasnt exactly a team full of rookies….
and for them to make this move 12+ hours after the loss yesterday, proves they have a plan to get a better coach…..woody just said the decision was made last night…….
so lets try to be positive…and hope for the best.
i feel bad for mangini…..but it was a risk to hire him thats for sure….and this collapse had to fall on the coaches. BYE BYE LIL MARTY…..and good riddance.
Later Mangina. I’m all for him being fired. It’s not re-building, it’s re-structuring. Now we get rid of Favre and we’ll be on our way.
How is Tannenbaum still here?
He brought in Orlano Pace who cannot cover anyone.
He brought in Ty Law who cannot tackle or cover anyone.
He brought in Farve.
Also where has David Harris been all year besides his injury?
Where has Kerry Rhodes been?
Bryan Thomas?
So when they bring back Parcells once again what happens next?
If you want to let Mangini go that is fine but Tannenbaum should be let go as well.
No Farve in 09 please!
The hit to the defense may be the worst considering we just got the pieces to it. It could negate Pace, Thomas (waa waa), Harris (then we should have kept Vilma), and Jenkins will move over again. I hate this team and city (Only for its ability to create heros and destroy them, otherwise I love NY).
A new head coach next year does not mean rebuilding. Look at Atlanta, Baltimore, Miami
“Woody and Tannenbaum were the ones who pushed for Favre, not Mangini.” Can you quote sources for this?
Tannebaum is the architect of a team with no identity, leadership, heart and soul. He is the culprit and it is an injustice if only Mangini is fired.
Mangini was a complete scapegoat here for a risky trade that backfired on this team. Not a great move here
Bassett, blaming a 5 game slide just on Favre is, on its face, difficult to legitimize. Favre is one of 22 starters (more if you consider special teams). Yes, the QB should and does bear a disproportionate amount of the blame, but teams like the Titans and Vikings are in the playoffs DESPITE of their QB play. If Favre was so big a part of the problem, then run the friggin ball and make only safe passes. So, if I’m the head coach and I think my 39-year old QB is hurting an limping towards the end, I play a grind it out game…like the Fins. That was all on the coaching. But, do we really think the offense, which scored 405 points was the real culprit? How about the fact that the defense collapsed, too. Worst pass defense in the NFL and the run defense began to slide. Mangini/Sutton were like the opposite of Buddy Ryan, who was accused of wanting to kill the QB at the expense of the big play. Mangini/Sutton were so afraid of the big play that the QB could have worn a tuxedo and eaten a 6 course meal. The 3-4 is a blitzing defense and the lack of a killer identity on defense (and offense) doomed this team. IMO, you could have grafted Elway, Montana, Peyton, Marino and Brady together and Mangini would still call plays for Brad Smith or only give Leon 130 odd touches on offense. Blame Favre all you want, but Woody got this right, Mangini needed to go.
I agree with you, Bassett. Like you, I worry that this firing might have been premature by at least one year.
Also, I definitely agree that bringing back Favre next year, (especially if that was the tipping point that caused Mangini’s firing,) would be a HUGE mistake! If there are no better options at QB next year, I’d rather ride our workhorses, Thomas Jones and Leon Washington, and hope for the best from a competition between Clemens and Ratliff.
Of course, there’s no doubt that the coaching was hurt most by Schotty and Sutton. But Mangini didn’t help his cause either. He made plenty of mistakes, and by all rights he should’ve replaced Sutton LAST offeason. Now it’s too late. And ultimately, regardless of how much of the blame falls on the coordinators, the buck still stops at the head coach. And he paid the piper today.
I just hope that he doesn’t duplicate his mentor’s career path, and resurface to develop into a true Man-genius in his next coaching gig, (if he gets one.)
And I really, REALLY hope that our next head coach is an improvement over Mangini, (like Cowher or Spagnuolo,) and not a step down. I’m keeping my fingers crossed! Go Jets!
tannenbaum bashing has to stop….the guy has drafted and brought in good talent.
i agree that mangini was a scapegoat of sorts…. but if we collapsed like this with chad as our QB he might have been fired also.
mangini’s in game decisions sucked…..s-u-c-k-e-d.
and as others have said…take a look at baltimore, atlanta, miami……coaches with attitude, who’s players go thru walls for them…. not happening with mangini.
Tanny doesnt coach the team. It is not his job to be on the sidelines to berate his players for not performing or to chew into his coordinators for awful playcalling. That is Mangini’s job.
This team followed their leader (Mangini) and that is why they show no emotion and dont get fired up. He stripped them of their identity.
Sutton and Shotty were AWFUL. They were Mangini’s picks.
Mangini and Favre were 8-3 everybody lloked great. Mangini was the same coach down the stretch but was crippled by Fvare and his horrible play in the last 5 games…..period!! I hope this works out but I am against this firing
They better stick to a 3-4 defense, we have all the pieces already in place. Pay Cowher whatever he wants and keep Shotty as the oc. I REPEAT, DO NOT BRING IN A 4-3 GUY, THEN WE WILL BE STUCK WITH GUYS WHO WILL NOT BE ABLE TO PLAY THE RIGHT POSITIONS………
Thank God Woody and Mike got this right. Now this is only step 1, now we have to fire ****ty and Sutton. I think we have to get Bill Cowher or spags to take over the job. Maybe we should consider Romeo Crennel to be the defensive coordinator, even though he had a bad year coaching the browns, he can be a good DC. After that, who knows, maybe somehow Cassel falls in our laps. Doubt it but hopeful.
DREW….favre was bad in the last 5 games no doubt…
BUT DID HE PUNT ON 4TH AND 2 IN SAN FRAN….. DID HE TAKE A FG ON 4TH AND INCHES IN SEATTLE?????
favre sucked the last 5…..sucked!! =) but mangini’s in game calls were awful as well…..
C’mon people…Mangina can’t manage the game…look at all the errors he made in the Seattle game. He didn’t step up to the plate with his horrible coordinators, coupled with his mismanagement, it’s the right decision.
Having Favre back would be insane. Almost all of his 20+ INT were awful.
zenlaw -
Yeah, that “few years to adjust’ factor really hurt the Dolphins, Ravens and Falcons this season.
This is unbelievable. Every other poster on this site was screaming for Mangini’s head all season, and now all I’m seeing is “what a mistake” and a lot of headshaking. Brett Favre is better at making up his mind than Jet fans.
Our players ran through walls in 06. Lets see Atlanta, Miami and Baltimore next year. Oh wait lets judge everything with a one year window. If one more person complimented Sparano on running a frickin QB sneak on 4th and a chain link. Sheesh people I did that the first time I played Madden. I still don’t regret cutting Pennington. It was what we did it for that was dumb.
and bye bye eric…and anyone else who thinks we should get cassel….
you should not be allowed to post on this site again.
yeah…we should go out and give that sidearm-slinging-cant-throw-deep loser from the pats….and overpay him.
S-Y-S-T-E-M QB….with great coaching…. and he is not coming here anyway so stop!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
derek you obviously see what you want to see, tannenbaum is not responsible for kerry rhodes(why is everybody throwing him under the bus after one bad year?) and further more he IS responsible for fanaca, thomas jones, leon washington, dustin keller, mangold, damien woody, darrelle revis and the list goes on…..if you wanna get technical on who brought who in, stop being so hasty to point blame, have some substance before you argue somethin like that. is it tanni”s fault we have 7 pro bowlers and didnt make the playoffs?? as far as im concerned the man did a better job than anyone else in the league….case closed
My sense tells me that Cowher will come here and that their feelers in the NFL led them to believe that.
If Favre comes back. I’m going to just watch college. I don’t care that Mangini is gone. I care that he is gone in one day. Do you think Woody even thought about it and what was going to happen? or just that he can’t make money with a collapse?
Is anyone else concerned they are bringing back Favre? That is absolutely scary! Not only does he have max – two okay at best years in him but he is going to have input on the next coach in place. If this is true the Jets have committed to going nowhere for at least the next couple of years.
Klecko71: You are 100% correct. Same for Crennel.
if favre comes back….he better say so IMMEDIATELY!!!
so the team knows the deal…..he will be better with a full offseason etc….
but with a new coach and coordinators….clemens or ratliff….or a veteran QB will be just fine with the overall talent we have.
Jets fans have the Joe Beningo syndrome. They will bash Mangini on the way out and then throw flowers at the new coaches feet….and then kill him next year. Especially if its a hot young coach like Spags. I hate Jet fans…..even though I am one
klecko71 – Favre already said he is not going to rush his decision.
SEAN….thanks =)
i have to admit though, i know alot of people who think crennel would be a good hire. he was never “sexy” (hell u cant be looking like him) =) but i for some reason dont think of him as my first choice either
maybe its b/c of the whole bellichek connection….
and that its sexier to hire a hot shot spagnuolo type….
just cant put my finger on why he isnt a great choice…. but my guess is that if he is the next DC it will be considered a good choice.
Tannenbaum was on the verge of winning executive of the year after 11 weeks. He’s not the coach. He gave a competent NFL coach a team that should have and could have won 12 games. Also, he’s the best salary capologist in the NFL. Killing him for Brett and not praising him for Mangold, Revis, Harris, Pace, Faneca, Leon, etc is short-sighted.
I’m already excited about next year!!!
Ugh, do not like this move at all, and they better not bring back Favre, maybe next year he can break the all-time single season interception record.
@Drew – I think most Jets fans thought a change needed to happen but not like the way it happened. Mangini got fired too soon and if its true the Jets want Favre back, its looking like Favre might have had input in his firing. And I think for most Jets fans they wanted Favre gone first not Mangini.
Mr T and Woody must know Favre is done because their is no way they want him back after that showing down the stretch.
Drew- I feel the same way. Yaay NY
klecko71, I agree with you that ratliff can be an okay qb, but kellen clemens is garbage. I have no faith in him whatsoever. And you said that Cassel is only good due to coaching, well that’s why we fired mangini to get someone like bill cowher
Dean…we all know what that means…..=) but i am just hoping that the decision is “timely” this time, as opposed to the crap he pulled the last 3-4 years in green bay.
the team wants him back….been reading it….. so as long as the decision is made in a time frame that doesnt hurt us…..i will be patient.
yes he struggled the last 5…BIG TIME…. but i would be ok with him coming back next year…. since our options are clemens, ratliff (love how 4 bombs in pre-season makes him a fan fave already)….or another journeyman QB.
this team has talent….it doesnt need favre or any other QB to throw for 4000 yards…so favre, with better overall coaching….will be juuuuust fine with me.
If the QB was the problem, why call so many pass plays our of the shotgun on 3rd and 2.? I don’t think Favre audible to those calls. Thos decisions came from the sidelines. Mangini’s downfall started when he did not go for it on 4th and 2 from the SF 37 on the first series of the game. It sent a signal that he was coaching not to lose rather than to win. Believe me, Parcells or Belichick would’ve had enough faith in their team to go for it. That call showed that Mangini had no faith in his team against a 4-8 opponent.
If Bill Cowher doesn’t come here how would you feel with Brian Billick?
Ultimately, I think it was determined that Mangini’s job would be impossible after the way the year played out. His ability to sell his approach to the team was probably terminally damaged by the collapse, whether or not he was entirely to blame for it.
At the end of the day, it was about results. Though he had good game plans and his team well-prepared against the Past and Titans, the failures against lesser teams was probably what did him in.
Well this is so simple now isn’t it?
Head Coach: Steve Spagnolo
DC: Romeo Crennel (was with Jets before)
OC: Promote Bill Callahan
Can I become to GM now?
Woody, either take note or CALL ME!
@ derek
and thats typical ny fan style to build up players to smash them down. why get on calvin pace because he cant cover anybody?? the man is a converted DE! do your homework, how about why is he out covering people when he should be rushing the qb consistently….its not his fault the coaching staff is in love with rushing 3. as a ny fan myself, i can honestly say some ny fans can be so dumb and hard to please. some know nuthin about the game…if its basketball, football or baseball, only thing in your vocabulary is WIN and when it doesnt go as planned…..blame him, him, him, and him…and you dont even know what your blaming them for. and just for the record…i dont mind mangini being fired, as long as he takes the coordinators with him. im kind of nervous on the alternatives though, outside of cowher, where do you turn to if that doesnt work out?
Curious – does anyone think Parcells might come back and Tannenbaum is about to become GM in name only? He does have that out in his Dolphins contract.
There is a silver lining to loosing yesterday…they fired Mangina and owe Green Bay a 3rd rounder instead of a 2nd rounder! :)
I sincerely hope the next Head Coach of the New York Jets is Bill Cowher. I want to see the Jets finally play with some fire and Cowher is someone that can make that happen. Goodbye Mangini and good luck. I respect Mangini for staying true to his principals and having the guts to turn in Belichick but he did not get the job done. He did not recognize the inadequacies of his coordinators and he was not able to get the entire team fired up when they really needed to be. So ends another unsuccessful chapter in New York Jets football. At least we are not the Detroit Lions. Perhaps someone can make something of this team next year…
i really dont put it all on favre…. yes many many bad decisions…
but how bout schotty lets leon and tj run the ball?
that aint favres fault its the coaches
byebyeeric…. cant agree that clemens is garbage yet.
he had some nice 4th qtrs….the ravens game that mcdropins cost him…..
the guy hasnt really been given a shot…..and chad beating him in camp this year before we got favre wasnt exactly surprising or an indictment of clemens…. chad came in super healthy….and we know he is talented….
guess we wait….and wait….like we are used to for 40 years =)
I agree sd99. That is the same reason I think Mangini deserved another year but if the other option is to get a proven winner in a head coach then Tannenbaum must do it.
I think the Jets are more attractive as an organization than they used to be and have a new stadium.
I still think Favre was and is a mistake but he sold tickets. Such a sham. I’m glad I am not a ticket holder of this team that is for certain.
KD…..backing me up….nice =)
Hopefully Favre’s MRI comes back and his shoulder is all messed up forcing him to retire, the Jets will not make the playoffs next year with Favre at QB, just like this year, no matter who is coach.
The Giants run the 4-3. Spags is the DC. The Jets do not have LBs with the speed necessary to play the 3-4. Getting Spags would be a huge mistake. The one thing that really set this franchise back was the switch to the 4-3 after Parcells/Groh. The same turnaround process takes, at least, 2-3 years. No Spags!!!
I think Woody has Cowher lined up. He has to go through the search process for minority candidates, but my money is on Cowher, who is the perfect fit.
Why would anyone want Parcells to come back?
As usual, I happen to disagree with Bassett that Favre was the problem. The problem with this team for most of the season was Defense. And Defense was supposedly Mangini’s expertise. The team played terrible defense the last 5 games and if it was for a stupid Bills mistake, would have gone 0-5 after being on top of the world at 8-3. Eric went from the Mangenius to the Stupidious. Having said the above, I wish mangini would have suceeded. But he didn’t. So good riddance and let’s star the Bill Cowher era.
thank the lord. he’ll be great one day. just not 2day.
I will agree with this firing as long as Schotty and Sutton are gone by the weekend.
I feel Mangini will be a good coach and that B.Belicheck was mad at him for leaving because he wanted to groom him more? Talk about an assumtion there. But it was inevitable due the the HORRENDOUS play of the team. The lack of motivation, the lack of heart, the lack of an identitiy.
I dont know how many of you heard what Favre said in the huddle, “If we win great, but if we lose, I love you guys…”
That has to be the biggest joke, is that the Favre that everyone was glamouring about? The guy didn’t want to play anymore and hopefully he realizes he is washed up.
I guess it just shows you how much of a LEADER Chad was to this team and no matter if the new guy is a sure hall of famer, doesnt mean he can lead!
FIRE SCHOTTY & SUTTON
Mr. T. has been doing a great job.. KEEP IT UP
and people stop with the re building talk….we obviously have a team built to win NOW!…you really cant argue that with the talent on the team. the only bad thing is that the talent on the team doeasnt have time for mangini to develope into a good head coach, by the time mangini is a seasoned vetetran coach who has learned from his mistakes…you probably have enitirely different team with people past their prime. i think mangini is a smart guy who knows his x’s and o’s, but i didnt like his attitude and demeanor. and his lack for motivating had alot to do with it as well. you cant coached scared when you have a talented team he did so and coached with no faith in his players and didnt exactly put them in a position to be effective. in the end it cost him his job, and i think this is simply a learning process and he’ll be fine in the future.
For the past 2 seasons i have been calling for Mangini to be fired. Watching him cripple our Team has been gut wrenching. You can blame the OC and DC , but who allowed them to botch things up? It all boils down to the HC. I hate the Pats with passion, but did you see Bellicheat manage the game in 60mph wins in Buffalo. He went for it on 4th down numerous times and made the calls to win. We thought we were getting a coach off of that tree, it was a mistake. When you let Denver come in and win, oh how i loved the Chargers beating them mercilessly, you have no game. Mangini was a bad choice. Hopefully we get a coach with some fire that can lead the jets and not over analyze everything.
This is a great day for the JETS. We decided to break the rut. Please no more NE coaches. Only one there has the “genius”, and can go f@#$ himself.
The Pats didn’t make it, Denver got throttled, and we got rid of Mangina. It is like a second xmas.
Happy Holidays all!!!
Favre’s performance down the stretch certainly didn’t help Mangini but one damning fact is two other coaches, McCarthy and Sparano, got much better results out of the same QBs Mangini had over the last two years.
I think Mangini is a very smart coach who does a lot of things well and may have been scapegoated to a certain degree. But this does send a message through the entire organization, in a very Parcells-like manner, that nothing but winning will be tolerated.
I agree with Bassett, Ed, Favre constantly put the defense in horrible positions with his horrendous decision making. Granted the Jets defense wasnt all league, but Favre’s performance down the stretch ruined this team. Last 5 games 2 TD’s and 9 Int’s, that is inexcusable and should fall directly on his shoulders, oops no pun intended.
I. Kewpie to KD Bart for the analysis it would have been nice to get from Woody and Mike.
II. Spags would be compounding a mistake because IIRC he has had most of his success with 4-3 style teams. (Way you go Ian). We have completed our transition from a 4-3 to a 3-4. Switching back will be painful and time consuming. We need someone who can upgrade the missing pieces by coaching, scheme or replacement. We don’t want to throw out the baby with the bath water.
III. Woody did the right thing keeping Tanny because Tanny was willing to part ways with Eric. Tanny gets one or two years to prove it was Eric and not him. I like this move. You build on what you have. I think our talent was misused. I expect a good coach can come in and win right now with what we have if the qB position is addressed. Now we will find out.
IV. I am with SackDance and his two brilliant analyses. Eric/Shott took Jones and Leon out of the game by relying almost excessively on Favre and the empty backfield. If Favre was erratic, go with your strengths. They never did address the WR who did not get open (Clowney was not even active), their version of WC lost a yard, and if Favre was the problem they could have run more, or put someone else in. And his post on Tanny mirrors my opinion in point III above. SD, hopefully now we will be proved prescient.
V. The performance of the NY media was abysmal. They shouted each other down. They asked really stupid questions. They asked them in an offensive way as though they are morons or did not want to get answers since they already knew the answers (one of the things I will miss about Eric is the way he handled these bozos). They missed opportunities to raise questions like KD.
Klecko71: I think Crennel, just like Mangini and many of the PATS players are simply products of the system. I doubt that with Belicheat as the head coach and probably one of the best defensive minds in NFL history that Crennel ever came up with any special schemes of his own and probably never had full control of that Defense, rather he simply implemented the orders given to him by Belicheat.
lmao@ swizzle…i like that one, that was funny
Favre did rush to throw his last pick. We were driving. That one is no coaches fault. Whatever protect the hero. He sucks.
Did Favre choose to start the Oakland game with 6 consecutive passes to Chris Baker? Did Favre choose to not run the ball in the Oak, Denver, SF games against some of the wost run defenses?
How many times did we see LW and TJ in the backfield at the same time? NEVER. Instead, Shotty coached himself right out of a job because he failed to use the talent he had (he will obviously gone with Big E).
Did Favre stop blitzing QBs or did Sutton stop calling blitzes, mixing schemes, and not use the talent he had on Defense?
Favre played terrible down the stretch, but first blame goes to the OC and DC.
To quote this site………….”In five years of Belichick’s first coaching stint in Cleveland, he was 36-44, 5-11 in his final season. It took Cowher twelve years to win a Super Bowl. Shanahan was 8-12 with the Raiders before going to Denver. Shanahan was 46 when he won it all, Cowher and Belichich were 49. Let’s give the guy a chance.”
NOW…..Lets look at the first three years of each coach.
Shanahan=28-20 ( .583)—– ( john Elway QB)
(year 1 =7-9)
(Year2= 8-8)
(Year3= 13-3)
Belichick = 20-28 (.417) ——–
(year 1 =6-10)
(Year 2= 7-9)
(year 3= 7-9)
Mangini = 23-25 ( .479) ——
(Year1= 10-6)
(year 2= 4-12)
(Year 3= 9-7)
Cowher= 32-16 (.667)——–
(Year 1 = 11-9)
(Year2=9-7)
(year3= 12-4)
NOW ASK ……. HOW BAD IS MANGINI????????????
Rumor is that Cowher will not coach, but that Gruden will be fired. I’ll take Gruden in a heartbeat. He’s smart, competitive and gets a lot out of mediocre QBs. He’s a proven winner and he’s still only 45.
Oh, I’d be happy with Gruden, too.
Sean said “Did Favre choose to start the Oakland game with 6 consecutive passes to Chris Baker?”
My answer is yes. You throw to the open man. Did the play call make him the hot read and aid his ability to get open as the main target maybe or with this offense even if it was designed to do that it might not have. Brett can’t control everything, but he decides where the ball goes after the snap.
Sack –
I guess you’re listening to WFAN right now too? :)
Totally agree about Gruden – I’d actually take him over cowher even if he were available (which it appears he’s not).
Yay we can get Gruden right after he did the same exact thing Mangini did.
Quit scapegoating Favre.. The Defense was as bad as he was..
Mangini is very Bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So long, farewell, goodbye.
Last time I check Gruden’s team collapsed worse then we did……Cowher told the Browns he wasnt interested in the HC job.
He kept giving the defense a short field to defend and going 3 and out all the time made them tired. They played a hell of a better game than the Offense did yesterday. Ginn and Fasano’s TDs were good to great catches, which are sometimes unavoidable. Favre gave them the game.
Brandon, I really think the Chin did an awesome job in Pittsburgh. He had a cheap ownership and terrible QB play (until Big Ben); yet, he installed an offensive and defensive system that just churned out wins despite the player carousel. But, Gruden is amazing at taking existing teams and raising their level of play. So, I prefer the Chin, but Gruden is a very close second.
As bad as the defense was at times Favre’s play was joke this year. B-Schott (stupidly) put the ball in Favre hands and he let everyone down. Point Blank! Mangini is fired now everyone can cheer for the next HC. Ridiculous!!
Green Guy -
Gruden has won 4 division titles and a superbowl – and he’s made the playoffs in 5 of his 11 seasons. He’s an awesome coach and we’d be lucky to get him. I’m actually stunned that he may be released.
let’s just bring in a guy who can show some damn emotion. We need that fire!!!
iduuno about gruden……..what makes him so credible?…and im not trying to be negative… i just really wanna know. tampa and the jets did the same exact thing this year
Defenses forced Favre to make decisions and read defenses after the Denver game. They followed the Shanahan’s blue print and Favre failed Big time!! As much as I hate C Banks he is actually making sense on WFAN right now
Did Favre decide to go empty backfield shotgun on almost every third and short down the stretch? Did Favre decide to abandon the run early on in games even though it was effective? Favre was awful down the stretch and was probably hurt but y ou can design a game plan that gets around that and doesn’t put the burden on him especially when you have the AFC’s leading runner, a couple of Pro Bowl linemen and a guy who is threat everytime he touches the ball in your backfield . I don’t believe he audible into all those calls.
Even though I just mocked Gruden’s collapse I would be very happy to get him here
I know a lot about Gruden. My two closest friends are Raiders and Dolphins fans. That coupled with being a Jets fan makes it clear I have very little taste. I don’t dislike Gruden at all. I just question if Tampa Bay is better now than when he got there. Dungy built a great team there and with the Colts. He won the super bowl with Dungy’s team (i.e. The year he got hired) and has produced many first round exits since. Over 11 seasons I’m not convinced our Ex coach wouldn’t have had similar results.
First and foremost, I’d like to thank Woody Johnson for another Xmas gift. Bye bye Eric!
Anyone on here who actually thinks Mangini was the man for the job is clueless. Mangini has demonstrated all year his inability to gameplan, motivate, lead, and get the most out of his players. He has consistently coached not to lose, instead of coaching to win. This team has talent, when talented players execute so poorly and inconsistently relative to their potential the head coach must take the fall. The coordinators were horrific, and that falls back on Man-Moron as well. LEAD and DIRECT your coordinators and players so they develop an identity and consistently improve. Schott and Sutton got 10x worse all year as the offense and defense looked worse then Florida or Oklahoma in NCAA ball. In order for this team to improve and the product on the field to get to the next level Mangini had to go. He lost his locker room for christ sake and some of you want him back????
Job Well Done Woody. ANYONE is better then Eric, ANYONE. Cowher, Spags etc. Now get #4 a true #1 wr, please trade coles, get a solid second corner, and this team wins 11-12 games next year.
Drew, Gruden’s team had no business being near the top of the NFC South the last couple of seasons. Look at the lack of offensive skill position players and their aging defense and explain to me how the Bucs have been in contention? That team has 1 Pro Bowler, the kick returner, and a reserve, Derek Brooks. Plus, while I’m no KC fan, Gruden’s West Coast offense could make him a Pro Bowler…KC is tailor-made for the West Coast.
KD Bart- We never ran an empty backfield until Favre got here. Watch Packers tape. He loves the formation we installed it for him (The Packers were running it last monday.). So yes it was for him. He lost yesterday too. Get a grip. We were designed to run and didn’t (the coaches should be fired. Mangini was teh only one who could have kept his job in my opinion) but don’t lie to me and pretend that Favre didn’t want the ball in his hands. Look at his career every step of this season was vintage Favre. Just because this is the first time we have seen more than sports center clips of him convince you of anything different.
Sack- the offense was limited by Garcia in many ways. Bryant, Graham, Galloway, Dunn and Stevens aren’t the worst skill players I can think of. Isn’t it partially his fault for not upgrading these positions. Tampa Bay is just watching Tony Dungy’s team whither away into the team Gruden built.
So, you’re telling me the Packers in all the years with Favre only ran plays out of the spread on 3rd and short. Never had him go under center with a full backfield. Because, it seems that’s all Shotty called down the stretch and then preceeded to have the same pass patterns runned as were run under Chad. Either a 4 yard out or a 30 yard bomb.
Im sort of happy with mangini fired but not ecstatic. I think the real grea t would have been to get marvin lewis out here as dc if he was fired
We didn’t have him do it on every 3rd and short, but I will swear to you on a stack of bibles it was just for Brett. Maybe he called those plays because it was his offense and I seem to remember a slighlty more expansive list of play calls just on the Stuckey drive that Favre threw away. Schott sucked, but Brett couldn’t execute a gas pump.
I think this was the right move. I admit Favre played several bad games, but the defense was atrocious. The defense consistently made average QB’s look great.Chad, Seneca Wallace, Shaun Hill, J.P Losman. The defense never made adjustments. Play calling was suspect all season. Time to make a move and get this straightened out. Too much talent to be sitting home for the playoffs.
To those of you who want to blame Favre for the “playcalling”: Remember, we had a 5 game winning streak. Our offense played well. What did we do? We ran the ball a ton, and Favre threw short to intermediate passes effectively. The last 5 games that strategy went out the window. Look at this numbers in those games. I think he averaged somethng like 20 completions for 180 yards. It appeared the coaching staff had found an identity for the offense. Then they completely went away from it. On another note, if I never see Brad Smith in the game again, it will be 2 soon.
JAGG, we disagree. I think those guys are retreads, but I agree with your criticism of his talent evaluation, but Tannenbaum has proven to be pretty good and, unlike Cowher, Gruden as a recently fired HC would not demand personnel control.
good point sackdance, i think im sold on gruden, lol. and why not? cowher already said he’s not coaching next year…so out of billick, gruden, schott, and probably some coach out of a div. I school, i think im good with gruden
my only problem is…..i have heard NOTHING about gruden being let go in tampa, so i really hope this isnt all hype and you guys wishing on a star. IF it is true, he would be a good look, and qb’s have flourished under his style (ecspecially rich gannon) so we’ll see.
I don’t think Favre is going to play another year but if he did maybe they’d bring in his buddy S. Mariucci. How about a Les Miles or a Mark Richt for some fire.
I hope we give some assistants a look. Smith, Harbaugh and Sparano don’t suck, they haven’t shown me enough yet, but we shouldn’t just hire a former head coach.
I’m not and have never been a Cowher fan- he routinely got outcoached in the playoffs and lost while fielding the superior team. I wouldn’t have the slightest confidence in the gameplans he would put together against Belicheck. In any event, I don’t think he’s a realistic option.
My personal preference would be for Jim Schwartz, as he’s a bright, competent and forward thinking coach. But I don’t see any candidate out there who makes me think this was a particularly good decision. Mangini got fired to please the fans and possibly to please Favre, and if you are making your decisions on that basis, you are asking for continued mediocrity.
Carl Banks is on the FAN advocating Marty Schottenheimer…talk about unrealistic! Isn’t his son on the verge of being fired?!? Yet, he’d go to the team that fired his son? Or, we’d get another season of little Schotty? Please shoot me now!!!
His son has been reportedly already been fired. See the update to the original post.
Seanmac – that’s my concern about Cowher too. We won’t go anywhere if we can’t get by the Pats, something which Cowher failed to do over and over again. Fans criticized Mangini for sticking to the same stuff even though it wasn’t working, but Cowher is a huge believer in “trusting the system” too.
Why do they have to fire Mangini? Was it really because the Jets lost..? If that is so then said ground is not sufficient to warrant firing of Mangini.. Mangini will be another loss for the Jets.
seanmac, talk about mediocrity, Mangini was 23-25 (0-1 in the playoffs). He presided over a terrible collapse, which was partially his fault. If I saw a team decimated by injuries or some other exogenous factor, then I’d say Mangini was unfairly scapegoated. But, he just made terrible coaching decisions, like in Seattle not going for it on fourth and a half yard on the 2 yard line, in the snow and against a terrible offensive team.
And, as for Cowher being out-coached, in his Super Bowl run, he beat Dungy and Shanahan in their stadiums. Having Big Ben throw 7 TDs to 1 INT, rather than Kordell Stewart throwing 3 INTs against the Pats might have something to do with being out-coached.
Yeah, I just never thought much of Cowher’s game day work. His organization is one of the best in football at drafting players to fit a system, but I thought Cowher generally underperformed when put on the spot. (Though it’s true that he didn’t have a quality quarterback for much of his tenure.)
I don’t really see anyone out there who is a perfect fit for the personnel. And I shudder to think that Favre might have some sort of say over the hiring process. It really seems as if Woody Johnson is determined to cater to Favre, which is a joke.
No college coaches or assistants (like spagnuolo). Bring in a proven winner and get marvin lewis as dc!!
And all you ppl advocating for westhofff as hc need to be shot
Seanmac – I wrote the new post about Favre before reading your comment, but would be interested to see you give your views there.
Remember in that playoff run how Bettis fumbled and they almost returned it for a score? I can’t remember the exact circumstances – was that a situation where Cowher was criticized for not simply running out the clock? Either way, he had a great run, but needed some luck.
He may or may not be the answer, but I do think that some people are backing him just because he is the biggest name. However, if he IS the biggest name then maybe bringing him in would sell more PSLs. Although I’m sure that isn’t a concern…
Bent and seanmac, BB is a great coach, maybe the best NFL coach since Lombardi. So, I’m not sure that Cowher’s 2 losses in the AFC Championship game, once with Kordell and in Big Ben’s rookie season, should count all that much. Big Ben has had better success against the Pats (2-2, right?)…like I said, a good QB makes coaches a lot smarter.
Bill Cowher
Great coach, yes. The best candidate, maybe not. But who knows?
I’d feel a lot better if he could bring Dick Lebeau with him (although that would still necessitate a change in system and almost as big of an upheaveal as changing back to 4-3…and also is never going to happen).
Bent, Steelers run a 3-4.
http://www.nfl.com/teams/pittsburghsteelers/depthchart?team=PIT
Mangini’s paralysis in the face of poor coaching by his assistants did him in. The Favre signing was simply a gamble – didn’t work. Now we MUST move on beyond Favre. Please! As for the other QBs, Kellen deserves a chance to play behind a decent line. Look at how it helped Chad this year. The players on D are overrated. Ellis, Barton, Coleman, Thomas are not the pass rushers that are needed. Yes we lacked coaching agressiveness, but these players clearly were unable to blitz properly when it was called on. On O, please move on beyond Coles. This team actually has a nucleus of young players on both sides of the ball to win consistently. Don’t just assume that Clemens can’t get it done. Give the kid a chance.
Though this has been the year of the rookie coach, I think the Jets will, and should, bring in a Cowher-like veteran with a track record, if not Cowher himself. The baggage of Same Old Jets is a heavy burden and it took a huge personality with a winning history like Parcells to shake it loose in the past. They also now have a roster full of FA vets that likely won’t respond well to a new jack coach. And that’s not even taking Favre into consideration, who will require the strongest hand possible if he returns, something I personally don’t advocate.
i really hope i am wrong but…… i think this is so risky for the jets…. unless we get a cowher or a spagnulo i think eric will catch on somewhere else and become a better coach… i know everyone is so happy but personally im thanking mangini for the job he did.. he wasnt the best but i enjoyed him a thousand times more than al groh, herm edwards, or any other crappy coach we have had……. thanks eric but as always go jets
Sack…I know, but there would still be a change in system if we adopted their scheme. Steelers 3-4 is very different to the Pats…smaller OLBs, more pass rushing, etc. I don’t believe Pace, BT or Gholston would fit on the weakside of their scheme for example. Murrell would, but is he good enough? Ellis would also be a little too small to play end.
C’mon, you know me better than to make an elementary mistake like that, doncha? ;o)
If u think about it, herm was a much better coach than eric. If doug brien hits a field goal in pitsburgh, hes still the coach
bent
the patriots rush the passer plenty, Mangini simply refused to do it
Cowher had a much better team in 1994 and lost at home to San Diego. He very nearly lost the next year to a 9-7 Colts team that was the worst team in the league the very next season. He lost at home to an admittedly very good Broncos team, but that was a game where the Steelers were still clear favorites. He lost at home to a rookie quarterback/to Drew Bledsoe in 2001. He probably should have lost to Herm in 2004. To be brutally honest, Cowher has a Super Bowl ring because Tony Dungy’s son killed himself two weeks before the playoff game (the Colts were clearly distracted) and because his team made 1-2 big plays and had a lot of help from the zebras in a Super Bowl where they were largely outplayed. Give Cowher all the credit in the world- he put his teams into those games to begin with, and he had a tremendously consistent run. I just don’t think he is a particularly talented game day coach.
If I had to choose among Parcells, Vemeil and Cowher, Cowher would solidly place third. I might even take Schottenheimer over him, though that’s up for debate.
seanmac
but Vermeil and Parcells are not options, Cowher is and he clearly the best coach out there
if cowher doesn’t take it. get billick or gruden. don’t even mention schotty sr.
He’s not clearly the best option. He’s a coach who is happy to be retired and would be coming back for the money, and he’s one who was successful because there was a strong front office in place to get him the players he needed. (The Steelers don’t exactly seem to be missing him, you’ll notice.) He also routinely had very strong assistant coaches on his staff. I wouldn’t say that Cowher is clearly a better option than going with an up and coming coordinator, not at all.
cowher knows how to build a team to the point where the jets can be playoff contenders year in and year out.
he knows how to motivate a team and is a good playcaller
After spending a ton of money for FAs that made sense the Jetsies rolled the dice with Favre and crapped out. They were using him to put fannies in the new building and it fell apart. So going into next season we have no QB…it makes absolutely no sense to bring Favre back ( which means they probably will!) and no coach. I’ve seen it all since Weeb and Joe Willie and nothing changes. Face it fans, we’re cursed with a mediocre organization with no reason for optimism.
how about mariucci?
i too have been a fan since the 60’s, and a season ticket holder for 20 years. this organization should have NEVER left shea and moved in as stepchildren to the giants. they have been mostly a franchise in disarray[except the parcell era] since then. no identity, no real home field and no passion. woody, really has no clue. 20,000 goofy dolphin fans? for a game that has playoff possibilities? i’m ashamed. think clearly woody and mike, and don’t think your future fan base numbers ,doesn’t depend on what you do.
Favre has cost Mangini his job! Chan Pennington would have won 12 games with this Jets Team and with this coach.
This Favre move was the owners move to sell seat licensing frees… nothing more.
I hope Favre retires because this owner Johnson is NUTS wanting Favre back!
Joe
i love this move we need a HC with heart. We need a guy who can get the team pumped up. mangini’s decisions were terrible and why you wouldnt run n thrid amd short or fourth and short with tj or leon is beyond me. one positive that came out of the collapse- mangini is gone
The Jets needed to hold people accountable for the collapse. Mangini and the coaches deserve more of the blame than any of the players. I’m a fan of the Penguin too and I think he was fired too early. The guy is smart. He beat the Patriots twice in Foxboro the past three years. Of course he lost five times but the Patriots were at top of the league. He just needed more game time experience to make better decisions. Hiring Bill Parcells to head football operations like in Miami would have been perfect. He can help Mangini in assessing his game decisions and kick the lazy butts on the team. Adding Romeo Crennel as defensive coordinator would also fit. It’s part of the old Parcells/Belichick gang. Bill Cowher would probably have to rip up the roster again to make it the way he likes it. Mangini I assume already built the team the way Parcells would accept it. Now it’s another team in transition year. Hopefully little Brett will be better than old Brett. Hopefully we don’t waste the talent (minus Farve) that Mangini and Tannenbaum already put together.