Buzz: Apparently We’re Into Tiers Now …
The leaks in this organization are flowing faster and more furious than in the restroom at Off The Wagon on a Friday night …
Take it with a grain of salt, but WFAN personality Mike Francessa’s “sauces” (read: Newspaper websites) that the Jets have classified their candidates into “tiers” yesterday.
First Tier: Russ Grimm, Rex Ryan, Steve Spagnuolo
Second Tier: Brian Schottenheimer, Jeff Jagodzinski, Brian Bilick etc.
I can’t say I disagree with those tierings, but again, what’s the motivation of releasing this information to a blabbermouth like Francessa? How are candidates who haven’t even interviewed yet in the first tier? My brain is unable to process it right now other than to placate fans that Brian Schottenheimer is not the lead candidate.
What do you think?
UPDATE: Francessa’s “sauces” was meant to be sarcastic. As commenters point out and most fans know, Francessa and Mike Tannenbaum are friends … or at least acquaintances that have a mutually beneficial PR relationship. Yes, that was sarcastic too …
Francessa appears to be the spearhead of the “tiers” story and many newspapers picked it up today.
You got it wrong on this one. Mike revealed this yesterday EXCLUSIVELY it was the Papers that picked it up. This is the audio where he revealed it and said “You can take it to the bank” http://www.wfan.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=3285338
It’s classic Francesa to take stuff from the papers or ESPN.com and report it as his own. Mike’s only Jets “sawce” is his good buddy Mr. T. Every time Mike talks about the Jets, I picture Tannenbaum working the puppet. Six weeks ago Mike was killing Favre and slobbering Mangini, and now he’s killing Mangini and saying Favre has become a scapegoat. Mr. T has been working Mike pretty good over the holidays.
tiers or no tiers, rex ryan has always and STILL does have my vote. But not to be close minded, what are the credentials on Russ Grimm?
…and a little off subject, but what do you think of the possibilty of jets drafting a RB in Chris Wells. A big bruising back with Thomas Jones’ instincts(but more explosivness and speed) and would be perfect to spell Leon Washington in the future, and I dont see the big deal in goin into next season with 3 running backs (Giants)…we can re-establish our selves as the running team that we were built to be, what do you guys think?…make up for not getting mcfadden last year, lol
roger,
LMAO @ “sawce”
hi gang … i should have clarified … that was meant sarcastically … sorry for the mixup … i always seem to forget that you can’t hear the voice in my head when I type … :)
i think we all know that he and Mr. T are friends, but it’s not fair to him to discredit things, that he did in fact break.
again, sorry about that .. i’ll update the post.
I think Mike just has a couple shots of tequila before each show and just lets the words flow…..he cant even keep his mouth shut without breathing, like his jaws are too heavy
sorry “his jaw”
Choosing B.Schott would lead to a fan revolt, not what the Woodhead wants for his PSL swindle.
I thought there was no way the idea the Jets could have leaked this was credible — until I listened to the audio. As I listened though, the Fat boy made too much sense to be dismissed out of hand.
I can see, Bassett, why you even raise the question, “what’s the motivation of releasing this information to a blabbermouth like Francessa?” It is possible it was leaked.
If so, it may have been leaked for the following reasons:
1) Shut up folks who expect a decision this week (and maybe next). If correct, all three 1st tier guys are still playing and may be playing next week.
2) Take away some of the negativity coming out of the News about Cowher and Shanahan “turning them down”.
3) Prevent a first tier guy like Ryan from believing he should take a job elsewhere because if he is competing with a guy like Shott he’d be a moron to stay in that process.
Anyway, good story and a Kewpie to Jerry for posting the audio link.
harlan
If I can’t get Cowher and/or Shanahan, which I can’t. Then I want Buddy’s son Rex as my HC. Defense wins Championships and he is a proven Defensive guru. He stopped Chad and the Wildcat offense cold. What did our Defensive guru’s do?? Zippo.
I dont want Schott anywhere near the offense. The BC HC is an offensive guru who would fit in great. Also would Rex bring his bro Rob to the JETS.
As to next year, we need a tall fast WR. Too many slow WRs on this roster which makes not playing Clowney more a real puzzle and another reason to not want Schott back. Another RB like Wells would also be welcome. You can’t play with only 2 RBs again next year. One injury and we would ne SOL.
definately would like to have a defensive minded coach over anything else ..but the OC and the DC need to be fired immediately with whoever comes in
if rex ryan comes in, i dont see anyway sutton stays, and the rest of the defensive coaches for that fact. but i wouldnt mind keping schotti around, i mean we did score alot last year ( thanks to the bloated arizona and st. louis games)
Sutton could not be fired fast enough.
I’ve always believed in the idea of not letting someone go unless you have someone better to replace him.
For example, was Pete Carroll a good NFL coach? No. Was he going to get the Jets to the promised land? Not a chance. But, he sure as hell was better than Kotite.
Now, I’m not saying the next coach is going to be as bad as Kotite, or that Mangini did a great job. But, I don’t see the point in firing Mangini after only 3 years, without having a home run replacement lined up. Replacing him with another inexperienced coach just makes it appear as if the organization’s “plan” is nothing more than throwing a whole bunch of crap against the wall and hoping something sticks. And, really, the Favre move was the result of the same mentality.
As for Rex Ryan, he may be a great coach. Who knows? But, I’m not sure how much magic he can work with the Jets defense unless he brings Knifey, Ed Reed, Suggs and Ngata with him. Look at the last successful Ravens D Coordinator. He didn’t exactly turn out to be a great head coach.
Roger Vick,
One of the issues with staying with Mangini was that he was entering the final year of his contract. You can’t have a lame duck coach (Coughlin was the exception, not the rule), and they probably would have needed to extend him in order to keep him on.
I agree that the Jets shouldn’t fire a coach without a plan in place. That said, Mangini had to go. As far as a plan, it appears there is one. I like the 3 top tier candidates more than Mangini, and obviously so does Woody and Tannenbaum.
The Jets need to bring in a disciplinarian.
If we can’t get Shanahan, then the only guy I am even remotely willing to see coach our team is Rex Ryan. Bring him in. Then he can recruit Ray Lewis who is a free agent after this season. Ray could be just the leader we need in a locker room full of discontent.
On the subject of Jabba the Hut…err… Mike Francesa…. I don’t take much of what he says to heart since he just likes to spit info out of his mouth to seem like ‘the wise old fat one’.
I agree… why fire Mangini a genius as a defensive coordinator, just to bring in another assistant coach to lead this team. We need some experience! We need someone who can turn the whole team around. The talent is there and we were talking super bowl just a few short weeks ago. This is a good team. What we need is someone who can work with the coaches better, prepare the team better, utilize the players correctly and simplify the system. I personally think Bilick is our best option. The guy wins big games and always picks great coaches. He likes to have a strong defense and run the ball. He won the super bowl with Trent Dilfer, so I’m sure he can work with Favre, Clemens or whoever we go with. I really hope we don’t end up with another Mangini type coach though. I would have rathered keep him than go with another assistant.
One of the problem roger vick is that the jets CAN NOT talk to other candidates intill they fire magini. So they COULD NOT ask cowher if he would like to coach intill they fired their current coach.
Its NFL policy and they could have gotten fined if they already had someone lined up to coach.
Bway Joe, Mangini is a defensive genius? Have to disagree. Belicheck is the only genius out there. Everyone of his coords have flopped as HC’s. That’s because it’s all Bill Belicheck. The guy is unbelievable. He loses coach after coach, and player after player, and still his team is either very good or great. Don’t like the guy, but he is the one and only “Mangenius” in the league, period.
Guys, does anyone agree we need a proven HEAD coach? I do not want another Coordinator!!!
History has shown they have failed…Herm…Mangina…
There is so much more to being a HEAD then X’s O’s…That is why I think Billick should be the guy…
Happy New Year everyone!
Bill Cowher was on Boomer and Carton this morning and he clarified a lot of the rumors that were circulated. He said he never took exception the WJ being out of town and not meeting with him because he is not coaching this year. He lavished praise on the Jets and how much he admired the organization and the team and fans. For all his (Cowher’s) denials, I got the impression that Cowher left the door slightly open if the right team came to him and wouldn’t take “no” for an answer. If thats the case I don’t see how the Jets are not taking no for an answer. They should be doing everything they can to get him to be the next caoch.
Mangini is a defensive genius? Did I miss a memo? Why did the Pats D stink the year he was DC?
Is it so hard for anyone to refer to a grown man by his actual name? Why read a comment if the writer is classless enough to call anyone Mangina? What are we 6? I’m in my 20s and saying this come on.
Good point Pete, when Mangini ran the Patsies D, I believe they were only ranked #26.
They had Troy Brown at corner that year too. They were banged up in 06, but he isn’t a genius. Only the media said he was.
I wonder if people are going to be weirded out when they watch that episode of the Sopranos (where Tony calls him the Mangenius) in 5, 10 or even 20 years.
Will it end up like when ESPN Classic runs the USC-Texas Rose Bowl from a few years ago and you can’t take the commentators seriously because they are saying that Bush, Young, Leinart and Jarrett are these amazing future NFL superstars?
Bent, I think Jarret actually had a catch this past weekend.
Good point Bent, unless of course he gets the Cleveland job and leads them to the superbowl, then the punch line becomes our favorite inept franchise.
I have to take exception with this notion that a coach has to have experience to be successful, has there never been a coordinator or assistant that succeeded in his first head coaching gig? I think there are plenty that have.
Pete- Jarret was on a bye. If he had a catch he was playing catch.
My mistake, it was 2 weeks ago.
I’m still suprised he has done so little. We went to high school in neighboring towns and I followed USC. I’m assuming it is all based off lousy work ethic.
JoeMustGo, sorry you took my comment to heart…But I never liked Mangini…So even though I am a mature, 30 year old male, I still think he is a Mangina…
First Tier Rex Ryan, Bill Cowher
Second Tier Steve Spagnuolo, Jeff Jagodzinski
Muliple “Tears” Brian Schottenheimer, Brian Bilick, etc.
Tony Kornheiser said the only valuable thing he’s ever said on MNF when Jarrett caught the ball.
I think he said something like “So I guess it could be said that [the QB] went to Jarrett?”
I really don’t like him on MNF but that was funny. I despise those Jared commercials but they’re so bad they’re funny.
Jagg, I followed his HS career and @ USC. The guy looked like he would be a great pro. Work ethic is probably right. Wasn’t there a famous line from some movie, “nothing good can come out of Jersey.”?
Before anyone gets upset, I live in NJ, and yes alot of good things have come from Jersey. Sinatra, Springsteen, tomatoes, ….
We have good corn too. Shaq and Bruce Willis too
You think he’s bad, think how a foreign fan who doesn’t get any of his references feels. (I do get his references, mostly, but most of the people I know who watch football over here just think he’s a complete idiot because none of his comments make sense – of course even when they do make sense, they still seem out of place). He’s bearable on PTI, but I agree the Tony K. experiment should end. He was probably so desperate to make that joke that when Jarrett made a catch I’m surprised he didn’t completely fudge his lines out of excitement.
On a not totally unrelated topic, albeit off at a complete tangent from the original post, American people don’t really find ESPN’s “Cheap Seats” funny, do they? We just started to get that show over here. I think I’d prefer to listen to any two of you guys waffling than those fellas. Ugh.
On Jarrett, I agree with JAGG that it’s surprising how little he has done, but WRs often don’t come into their own until year two and he lost most of year one with an injury, so maybe year three will see better success for him.
Well, they didn’t have to fire Mangini the day after the season, and they could have used back channels to find out if Cowher and Shanahan planned on coaching this year. It appears that’s what Jerry Jones did. He wanted an experienced, proven, win-now coach. So, he held on to the guy he had and waited to see what those guys were going to do. When it became clear they were sitting out a year, he decided to give Phillip one more year to get it done, and if he doesn’t, the big names will be available. It’s not an unreasonable approach.
You don’t run a successful organization by always saying, “we have to get rid of this guy, because anyone we get will be better.” You have to have a plan and stick with it, unless you know you can make an upgrade. Didn’t we just go through all that with the QB?
I dislike cheap seats and hate Kornheiser talking football. That whole if I were a writer for this team my headline would be stuff is horrible. When will my headline be published he has done it twice… “Come back player of the year fails to come back”
I did like PTI back when I could watch it though.
JtotheEtotheTtotheS!
Andrew Weiss wrote on the site last week that there’s an interesting fact … no coach who has won a SB in the modern era has ever won one with another team. So there’s something to be said for finding an up and coming coordinator, but you are right in that finding a vet head coach might be a safer bet.
Listen to the Glazer interview down the page in the daily links, and you’ll hear about how he opines on new head coaches and how they act like “hardasses” but readjust their personalities … he said something like “the sooner they act like themselves, the sooner they find success”
I often wondered if Mangini ever got comfortable in his own skin as a HC for the Jets … maybe he will somewhere else, which is what I most feared.
To continue the Jersey hype, don’t forget Jon Bon Jovi. Hey, maybe the Jets can interview him. They always do seem to be living on a prayer.
Freeman, I purposely left Bon Jovi off the list.
Mangini lost his HC job in the snow in Seattle. At that time, I’m sure Woody and Tanny had discussions and started to draw up a list. I also think the reason Mangini was fired immediately after the season was over was because nobody knew Cowher’s intentions and the Browns, who wanted Cowher, would’ve had a head start over the Jets if Cowher had wanted to coach.
As for the established coach over the coordinator talk, not all coordinators are equal. Rex Ryan has been a respected DC for a while and was DC of the year in ‘06. That’s a far cry from Mangini, who left after 1 year as a DC. The same is true for Spags, who is a respected and established DC. If we want to scratch our heads, do so over the Russ Grimm talk. But, arguably, even he has more coordinator (and practical) experience than Mangini ever did.
I have no doubt that Mangini will be a good HC, but he needs work, especially with in-game adjustments and he has to learn how to build a team with an identity. Now, maybe he was frustrated with the Jets because he was saddled with QBs that he didn’t want. But, that doesn’t excuse the Jets defensive failings. After 3 years and a 23-25 record, how much longer should Mangini have gotten? This year’s collapse was a firing offense and of the 5 terrible collapses this year (Bucs, Bears, Broncos, Cowboys and Jets), already 2 coaches are gone and I’d lay money that Gruden and Phillips will be gone soon.
LOL Pete… I feel ya. We can leave them off the list.
Roger Vick, Tanny and Woody stated that they were looking at the HC position for weeks. Do you think they had no idea where Cowher’s head was at? Of course they did. Again, they had a plan in place should they decide to fire Mangini. After the Miami game they decided to fire him and put the plan in motion. The Shanahan firing came as a big surprise and shock to everyone. But they did the right thing and reached out to his agent. We’ll see in a couple of weeks if he’s interested. But the list of candidates the Jets have was obviously put together well before the season ended.
They like Ryan alot, and before his interview, Spags as well. None of us knows all the planning they did or didn’t do.
We traded Jovi to Philly anyway
Does Boldin still want out of Arizona and if so is there anyway the Jets could say send Coles and a high draft pick to get him or just a draft pick? Any chancce of signing Bart Scott to replace Barton?
The Jets should be interviewing Ryan next week according to the Daily news, which is great as he is the best option out there.
Sackdance, I could see Phillips gone or put back as a DC and Shanny coming in since he apparently has a good relationship with Jerry Jones.
“Now, maybe he was frustrated with the Jets because he was saddled with QBs that he didn’t want. But, that doesn’t excuse the Jets defensive failings.”
It also doesn’t excuse his inability to develop his own QB.
I too have a problem with the Jets going the coordinator route. Specifically, Spags has only been a DC for two years and his name wasn’t really in the loop until he blitzed Brady 80,000 times in the Super Bowl. He’s done a nice job this season but without that SB win, is he really a favorite? Rex Ryan has been a DC for three years and, admittedly, the Ravens have a great D under him. However, he has done so with xtremely talented players. Without the likes of Lewis, Reed, Suggs etc. will he be that great. I can think of numerous coaches who have done well because of the level of skill on the team, not because of their scheme.
Of course, simply because an experienced HC has won a SB before does not mean he will do it again. But who says the Jets should aim for a HC who has won it all before. You need someone who has had their teeth sharpened as a HC and now is ready to take the next step. Mangini showed he wasn’t seasoned enough this season and it costs the Jets. That’s why I think Marty would make a great coach for the Jets (However, he would retain his son and that is why I hope the Jets do not get him).
All that being said, I jumped on the FIRE MANGINI! band wagon after the Seattle loss. It appears that Woody had the same reaction. I think that was the right reaction for a fan but not for an owner. Of course, no one could have predicted that HC’s would avoid the Jets like the plague but, in hindsight, it appears that the right move would have been to do what the Giants did, keep the HC and fire the Coordinators.
I just wish there was a clear upgrade over Mangini out there, as other commentators have noted, there is not.
Blame, how can you describe the coach we need as, “someone who has had their teeth sharpened as a HC and now is ready to take the next step.”, and then conjure up Marty Schottenheimer? He has not only had his teeth sharpened, but he’s had 5 root canals and his entire gums have been deep cleaned. I’m not saying he would be the worst choice but he doesn’t fit your description.
Also, a coach with a solid resume who has a little fire in the belly would be an upgrade over mangini. Rex Ryan, Billick, Shanahan, M Schotty, even Bill Callahan, would all be upgrades. By the way, Callhan fits your description pretty well, and he’s obviously familiar with the team.
Callahan won for one year with Jon Gruden’s team and made no adjustments, hence why Gruden destroyed him in the Super Bowl. He wasn’t a good college or pro head coach. He has however been a great coordinator.
[tapping microphone]
.. is this thing on? my “leaks” / off the wagon joke went over like a lead balloon …
come on people! :)
i want ROD MARINELLI at least he was consistent….LMAO…..
The Jets MUST fire both coordinators! with those two idiots gone we will be a better Team already. Cowher is not coming and Shanahan is still a maybe. even though we have not had sucsess before with Coordinators as head Coaches i can’t put Herm and Mangini in the same class as Rex Ryan so i would’nt mind giving him a shot. we need to draft a Tall Fast WR fast, Coles is not cutting it in my book.Cotchery is better in all aspects especialy keeping his mouth shut and playing with Heart. also the 3/4 Defense has not worked for us and seeing how the Ravens play D it is time to make a change. what do you think guys?
I heard from sources unwilling to identify themselves due to the closeness to the team that MARINELLI is on WODDY”S TOP SECRET TIER LIST…..SHOOT thats better than MIKE IN THE MORNING reading and copying all our post on here….and then going public with them today WE SHOULD SUE HIM LOL
Gang, “top secret tier list”, very funny
sec108 and SackDance99 both nailed it. All of the “if we pick a coordinator, we have to start all over” talk is unsubstantiated and ignorant. Plus, grabbing a Ryan or a Spags wouldn’t be like picking Mangini, which seemed like a pretty impulsive decision at the time considering his lack of experience.
Re: The argument that a team shouldn’t fire a coach without having another in place. It’s certainly a time-tested strategy with girl friends and wives, but not coaches. While coaches are not paragons of honesty, is does look particularly bad to be found out as having gone after another coach’s job before he has actually been fired. And with a current coach still in place it will inevitably limit the number of willing candidates.
Bassett: You should try Brother Jimmy’s! Ever go there?
md, its definitely a smart move with girlfriends and wives to wait for a suitable replacement. Touche.
Pete57
Simple 200-126 record, with a bad post-season record. Obviously the next step for him would be some wins in the post-season and with our strong rushing personnel it could happen. I don’t see why you are confused. Are you saying he is not seasoned? Or not ready to take the next step? I see no reason why you would think either.
Good point, however, on Callahan. He put together a very good offense while he was in Oakland. However, it is hard, as always, to know how much of that is attributed to Gruden and how much to him (Gruden had success as a coordinator in GB prior to Oakland). Perhaps that is a risk they will have to take. It is fair to say I wouldn’t hate him as a HC.
However, I disagree that someone with fire in their belly is a clear upgrade over Mangini. Herm had fire in his belly and had a fairly solid resume in Tampa (albeit with limited play calling duties). He, however, is a terrible HC (see NYJ or KC). [Uggh, I just realized that he could fit into my description so maybe it needs refinement]
Guys cool off…we do have a more serious problem.
Francesca on WFAN was asserting that Mangini was fired because he had a problem with Woody! He did not like how Woody was involved on team matters.
Now let’s see.
Parcells, Belicheat, Groh, Herm, and Mangini ALL of them had problems with Woody!!!?
Soon we’ll have to get into draft/needs commentary, but I agree with the critics that say the Jets need more team speed on defense. This franchise will be hamstrung by the VG pick because the speed should be added at ROLB (where VG should be playing) and LILB (to help cover the TE). I also wonder if Pace hit a wall this season, which was only his second full season at LOLB…he seemed a little slower at the end of the season. We could also use more speed at the Safety position because Elam is not that fast, but more speed at the LB position would make the pass rush better, which might not expose the safeties as much and, if the pass rush is very good, the TE will have to stay in to block, further helping the safeties. I’m not sure speedy defensive players will be around at 17, so I’m projecting that the most BPA value will be at RB, like Moreno or Wells. I think an FA like Bart Scott could help the LB corps (esp. if Rex is hired), but I’m afraid that the VG pick might cause the Jets not to upgrade ROLB, which is probably the 2nd most important position in the 3-4 after NT. Just another example how a bad top pick can set a franchise back.
I kinda see Woody being to involved…Does he think he is Jerry Jones?
Also, I made a comment before about Billick and how he should be the guy….He is a TRUE successful HEAD! From there, the JETS can bring in a young DC and keep Marty’s kid for the OC…Maybe Fassel would want to work with his best buddy Billick in NY? Might be to $$ but what about that idea?
I’m still not over the Jets not being a playoff team…Even though 9-7 was better then 4-12!
Cheers!
Blame, I think you posting M Schotty’s record makes my point. He is long past the time to “take the next step”. He would’ve done it long ago. That was my point.
This is not news, everyone knows the jets end every season in tears.