Musings From Manchester
Thoughts from the car … while I was not pouting like a baby.
Tony Gonzalez Trade — It was an interesting development that the Falcons traded for Gonzo. It takes one team out of the Pettigrew sweepstakes, it might provide them a trade partner if the team wants to move down, but with the Iggles sitting in between and needing a Tight End, it means that the Jets better not have their heart set on Pettigrew if they move off to 24.
Quarterback Campbell? — The Redskins aren’t much of a team when it comes to being patient, and to put the Redskins flameout all on Jason Campbell seems preposterous. Yes, the first half of his season was better than his second, but I think that getting Campbell would be an interesting play. I don’t know if trading for Campbell makes him the de facto starter or not, but you’d have to think he’d get a leg up if that was the case.
Quarterback Quinn? — OK, OK, I might have been a bit rash in my renouncing my Jet fandom if Brady Quinn becomes a Jet yesterday. I think you have to trust Charlie Weis’ assessment of whether or not this kid is ready to play. His contract holdout and his diva demeanor rankle me some, but Quinn is smart, athletic, and has enough collegiate experience, and experience with the right coach during his upperclassmen years, that he’s got to be more ready than he’s portrayed to be. Trading Quinn, in Ohio though seems an improbable task. You have to wonder what the value would be for Quinn … a proven top-tier QB like Cutler netted two ones, a three and a pick in return, while Cassel was worth a two, with an aging Pro-Bowler attached. I don’t know that I’d pay a one for Quinn. For a two I’d probably do it in a heartbeat.
Durrrty Sanchez — It’s amazing how all over the board Sanchez is being talked about. The Jets are making overtures that they want him, but I struggle to think the Jets have enough juice to get into the single digits to get him. The thing that makes me most nervous about him is that 16 career collegiate starts number. I know starts at USC can be treated akin to dog years to other schools, but it just makes me nervous to think about how much time they need to put in with him before he’s ready, really ready, to start in the NFL. Still, I’m notoriously bad at evaluating QBs, so please don’t take my word for it. I didn’t like Matt Ryan last year, I even attended his Pro Day, met him in person and walked away unenthused.
46 Responses to Musings From Manchester
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JustAGreenGuy says:
Giving the 17th pick for a guy who was drafted at 20 and has left no impact is not Tanny’s way. If they want more than a 2 for Quinn tell Mankok to stick it.
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MS says:
Of those three I would prefer Quinn. All three are young, but in my opinion we have seen the best of Campbell (which is average) and don’t know much about Sanchez. I don’t think Quinn has proven himself yet, but he is more proven than Sanchez and has much more potential than Campbell. I think we can get Quinn for a 2 if they do indeed take Sanchez at #5, but his price may be higher if the Browns don’t get Sanchez. I also wonder if we can lesson the price if we send Clemens to the Browns (maybe Clemens and a 3rd for Quinn).
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Bent says: Of course they can’t trade VG because of all the dead money that would arise.
Serious question, Ed(itor) are you a Notre Dame fan? You often seem to be recommending their guys. Any views on Clausen as a 2010 option?
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Sorry to hear about the trip. Keep it up I need your analysis and coverage to be the light in these dark draft times.
Super bowl!
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Marc says:
The talk of Sanchez going in the top 5 could simply be teams trying to increase their trade value. I still think Sanchez will slip to the 8th pick, unless some team decides to give up an exorbitant amount for him… I’m wondering how steep the price would actually be though. It seems everyone wants to move out of the top 10, so maybe their will be a discount this year.
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Bob says:
I would trade for Quinn with a 3rd and a player like Eric Smith (one of Mangini’s guys) and try to trade back a few spots in the first and recoup that third rounder.
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Kyle says:
Jason Campbell has proved he is a stellar QB. I have never seen a young quarterback survive three offensive coordinators and two head coaches, but somehow he gets better every year.
We need to make a move for him.
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swizzle81 says:
Don’t you guys think there is a reason Campbell and Quinn are on the trading block? They cannot help their teams win right now and may never do so. Throwing one of these guys into a new offense, see how well Favre did with that, is just another recipe for disaster, plus neither of them are that good. Stick with KC or Ratliff, trade down in the draft to accumulate picks, or trade the number 1 for Boldin.
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Mike S. says:
Zorn is a west coast guy and Campbell is more of a Air Coryell QB — it seems unlikely that this relationship will last. While the kid still needs to work on his footwork and technique to improve his accuracy, he has great physical tools and has started 36 games in one of the toughest divisions in football the last 3 years (with average talents like Moss, Randle El, and Cooley his main receiving options)
If the kid is available at an attractive price, the Jets should take a look. If you surround him with tall WRs and a strong offensive line, he can play the Joe Flacco role. -
J-E-T-S says:
MS, Campbell is still getting better and he is already a good starting QB who can control the ball.
Quinn is a unproven QB with a lot of potential I will admit but Campbell is good and only getting better and he is already pretty good. -
dave04 says:
Embrace Quinn and embrace another 40 years without a Super Bowl for the Jets. There’s a reason why Quinn wasn’t picked until #22 in ’07 and started 3 games and attempted 100 passes in 2 years, HE STINKS – and not to mention OVERRATED by ND fans and media who attended that dump of an institution.
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Watch the Jets trade up and grab Curry, Crabtree, or Raji.
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The Ed(itor) says:
What is a perfect day for the JETS in my opinion:
1 Take Moreno at #17
2. Trade Gholston or a 4th and Ainge to the Browns for Quinn. Adding Smith to deal would not upset me.
3. Trade up to take Nicks or Britt in round 2. -
Bent,
I do like ND and I do think that Jimmy Clausen could be the top QB in the 2011 draft unless you think he is coming out early. -
swizzle- the redskins are impatient bastards that don’t realize the crap they keep throwing Campbell into.
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Ed, Jets cannot trade VG, cap hit would be too much, so stop dreaming and give the guy another season with a defensive coach who knows what he is doing.
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SackDance99 says:
I agree wholeheartedly on Campbell. He’s improved every year and showed that he has the potential to be a solid NFL QB, which is more than we can say for any QB on the Jets roster. As for Quinn, I never thought he was going to be a good NFL QB. He doesn’t have good arm strength and he’s not mechanically sound. Also, he does not have ideal height. What does it say that Mangini would prefer to deal Quinn (an Ohio god) over Derek Anderson? Honestly, I think KC has more of a chance to be a successful NFL QB than Quinn and I think Ratty is a much better prospect…better arm strength and he’s bigger. Getting Quinn would be a colossal waste.
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Im with Dave no quinn but I wouldnt say 40 years of no super bowl
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The Ed(itor) – Love the idea, but if you think that perfect day is a possibility, then I have a bride in Brooklyn to sell you, as well as a PSL for 2010.
But dare to dream.
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Quinn was awesome at ND. I don’t like ND, but every time I watched the guy he threw for 3TD and lead his team back from deep deficiets. I’ll take him over Campbell any day, but not for a first.
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GlockNSoul says:
We have to see through some of the smoke. Why would Seattle (Pro Bowl incumbent with 4-5 years left) and Cleveland (Quinn and Anderson) want Sanchez? All of the sudden, Sanchez has gone from a possible first-rounder to a top 5 pick? Did he play a few games after the bowl game that I missed?
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Bent says:
Thanks Ed…yes, I meant if he came out early.
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What kind of a cap hit would Quinn be?
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Great – we could be the one to put Campbell with his 9th different OC in 7 years? Boy, that sounds like a recipe for success ! There is a common thread to his OC being replaced every year, and the initials are JC.
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Justagreenguy- How many times hae we heard of a good college qb become not much in the NFL.
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It was reported that Quinn signed a 5 year deal with the Browns in 2007 worth a reported $20.2 million, with $7.5 million guaranteed. He could make up to $30 million with incentives over those 5 years.
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Bent says:
Glock…he has a low 2009 salary but a lot of escalators and incentives that full details have never been released for. It may be possible to afford him without trading the first round pick, but I can’t say for sure. Overall, his deal isn’t too bad as it is heavily incentive based.
If they needed to make room, maybe they give up their first rounder, but get a 2010 first rounder back and then hope Mangini doesn’t have as good of a first year as he did with the Jets. The only other effective way to clear cap space would be to include Ellis in the deal.
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Quinn was 0-3 against USC and 0-3 in bowl games. He was, no doubt, a prolific college QB. Since ND is always on TV, I just thought he was a “system” QB (even though Weis ran a pro style offense, Quinn had superior skill position players). In tough games, against really good defensive competition (like Michigan, Michigan St. or USC), Quinn wasn’t up to snuff. But, I really didn’t like his deep throws…woobly and too much air underneath. With Samardja basically dominating any college CB, Quinn had the ability to fling it up there. In the NFL, those throws are INTs. I just don’t see how Quinn’s first few NFL starts were any better than KC’s? And, everyone here knows, I don’t think KC can be a bona fide NFL starter.
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Ed(itor), why would Mangina want VG? He destroyed his progress last year.
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J-E-T-S- Agreed, but no risk no reward. I couldn’t dislike Campbell more and of the other options presented Quinn at the right price seems appealing to me. He carried ND for a couple years and is still young. The first two games he played he left the field with his team winning. I think he would love the NY spotlight (Because he is a cocky jerk) and could show us something. I still question his arm strength tho.
If we could trade our first for Quinn and the browns early second rounder I’m satisfied. Quinn. a WR (or other need), and Jarron Gilbert would make me a happy man for the first day.
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By the way, strike my height comment, the Browns put Quinn back up to 6-3…for a while, they had Quinn down to 6-2…teams play all these games with height, it’s hard to find out something that should be simple.
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My post was lost, so here are the highlights. Trading our 1st for Quinn and the Browns 37th pick(?). Would give us a possible QB, a shot at Jarron Gilbert, and another 2nd rounder for a RB,WR, whatever. That sounds pretty good to me. I’m not sold Quinn will be good, but no risk no reward.
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Oh and should help our cap.
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JetOrange says:
Quinn for a second is the best alternative
Sanchez fever has broken out, he will be too expensive, recent propaganda has him going to the Hawks at 4. Snyder of the Skins has the fever, to ensure getting Sanchez, he needs to get to 3 the Kansas City pick. If you pull out your old Draft Value Chart, you will see that 17 and 13 (Skins Pick) gets you to 3. The Skins have only 5 picks in this years draft (1,3,5,6,7). I would prefer to send 17 to Snyder for a Patriot type deal, 3&5 in 2009, a first and fourth in 2010. The only Washington player I want is Devin Thomas WR 6’2 215, 34th pick in 2008, although he only had 15 catches last season, I believe he is the best solution to the WR position after Crabtree and Maclin. 17 for 3&5 and Thomas, Win/Win. I am not a big Campbell fan, but I think he is the game manager that Rex would like.In fact IMO Rex would pick Campbell over Cutler just because of style of play. Campbell is the last year of his contract, so his value is diminished, so he could be part of a deal for 17. A typical Tanny Deal is 17 for Campbell for a 3&5, Campbell and a first round pick in 2010, if Campbell doesn’t sign. Sanchez fever is an opprotunity to throw Danny and the Skins under the Bus. -
Based upon NFL success, the fact that Campbell is ahead in his development, and that both Quinn and Campbell were low first rounders, I just don’t understand the logic of paying more for Quinn than for Campbell. A second rounder, IMO, is way too high for either. A 4th rounder sounds better to me.
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Bent says:
My assessment of Quinn in college was that he works the short passing game well, but when going downfield he usually just threw it up for grabs and one of his big receivers (they had several) went up to get it.
He’d have been a horrible fit with the Jets personnel these last few years, although they will probably add a bigger target to the mix this year.
I’m sure he’s going to be an okay QB, maybe better. Okay might even be an upgrade over what the Jets have now…and might be enough for them to win with.
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wesleywalker7 says:
how bout clemens and 4th for Quinn?
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Zartan says:
Cambell has showed that hes a good QB andis still learning. The guy will be better than a Chad in a Few year at his pace. if you can get him for a 3rd or 4th pick ,do it.
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What pace? Campbell has been bad to mediocre his entire career. They were a better team with Todd Collins at the helm. We could have got Leftwich for no draft picks and he is much better than Campbell.
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vinnywasthebest says:
I was skeptical of campbell, but he had better PHYSICAL tools than Clemens (height) and more experience than Ratty. Last year of contract, so we dont have to sign him in the trade and hes cheap. We can see what hes got in camp. But our MOST glaring need is an EX{ERIENCED no1 receiver. TE is pretty big too.
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Brandon says:
I want to see the Jets get Campbell and draft Knowshon in the first round.
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jet4lif says:
As much as I dont like either Quinn or Campbell(back from auburn days), Campbell has definitely improved a lot over these yrs. I wont mind swapping our 2nd for washington’s 3rd. (But guess what, I bet you guys they dont even have a 3rd rounder). Otherwise Campbell is not worth anthing less than a 4th rdr.
Campbell would at least mitigate the risk of having unknown QBs on our roster. If Clemens or Ratliff pans out then I dont give a damn about the 4th rdr lost on Campbell.
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How is 13 touchdowns in your 3rd year of starting good? Seriously, am I on crazy pills? I’ll take KC, Ratty or Ainge and their experience in our system over losing a pick for an underachiever.
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all im saying is if we trade for quinn we mind as well trade for edwards as well we need a QB and WR why go half way and not full throttle….imo
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ramble914 says:
If we were to get Campbell, there’s a distinct possibility that next year he would be in his 10 system is 9 years, as Schottemheimer may leave to be a HC.
I would trade Gholston, Mangini’s bust to Mangini for Quinn in a NY minute.