The Rundown: Gholston Gaining in a Defense to be Tailored For Him?
Rex giveth and Rex taketh away. As are the rules in Florham Park, if you get a game ball, then get a national award, your ball gets redistributed to a teammate.
The Rex Rules are the rules, and one rule says that if you get a game ball on Monday for your play on Sunday but then you get a league award on Wednesday, you give the game ball back. Such was the case with Jason Trusnik, who received his second game ball of the season for his special teams play against Tennessee but then was honored earlier today with the AFC Special Teams Player of the Week award.
And so “after further review,” Ryan and his staff have regifted Trusnik’s game ball to … LB Vernon Gholston.
“I thought Vernon did an outstanding job Sunday. He prevented a touchdown on sheer hustle,” Ryan said of Gholston’s solo tackle of Tennessee’s Chris Johnson 30 yards downfield at the end of a fourth-quarter run that, had No. 50 not been so inclined, was ticketed to become a game-tying 73-yard TD run. Instead the Titans ran three plays and punted and the Jets held their 24-17 lead.
We’ve always contended it would be a long road to get Vernon Gholston ready for prime time, and while some fans have voiced that frustration rather vociferously, Rod Boone reports that the coaching staff is seeing some things that they like in his game of late.
Gholston just plays without a lot of flash, defensive coordinator Mike Pettine said.
“Vernon’s strength is exactly that, his strength, and that’s something we’ve taken advantage of,” Pettine said Thursday. “A lot of times that involves him knocking guys back and taking two blockers, and those are thankless jobs. Those are things that go unnoticed. That’s why we’re high on him because he’s great while he’s doing his job. That’s the whole motto of our defense: Do your job and good things will happen.”
Talk like that was blasphemous under Eric Mangini. Want more heretical statements for Mangini? You got it.
Ryan said that he, unlike his predecessor Eric Mangini, would’ve changed his defense to fit ex-Jets and current Saints LB Jonathan Vilma rather than try to fit the player into an ill-fitting scheme.
Vilma, the NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year in 2004 while playing in a 4-3 alignment, couldn’t adapt to Mangini’s 3-4 scheme and was traded.
“I like Vilma,” said Ryan. “He’s a tremendous player. We wanted to draft him when I was in Baltimore. He’s our kind of guy. The scheme wasn’t a great fit if you’re going to play a traditional 3-4 defense like Eric had.
“I will say this, with us we pick our players over schemes. We’re not going to pigeon hole our guys into a system. We’re going to make the system adaptable to the players.”
That’s a ballsy statement, if I’ve ever heard one. Players over schemes? For all Ryan’s bluster, that shows an inherent lack of ego about “his” defense.
Your job was to fit into a round hole if you were a square peg, and if you couldn’t do that, then you were buried on the depth chart, end of story.
Ryan and Pettine seem to be taking a rather grown up approach to the matter and will suit their scheme to the player. Obscene, right? Once Rex was hired (and probably before) we’ve said that if anyone can coax game out of Gholston, it will be Ryan. Gholston’s doing the little things now, and that’s a good next step. Let’s see how he continues to progress from here.
Filed under: Links, News, Opinion, Opinion/Bassett
If, as has been mentioned in a times, VG’s maybe a bit fragile psycologically after his treatment by Mangini last year, this award might be just what the guy needs…to feel an important, or at the very least a useful piece of the team
http://www.newyorkjets.com/news/multimedia/audio/137-jets-radio-8-16-09-camp-interview-with-chuck-smith
Great interview of Chuck Smith over summer training camp. Smith is a Guest Coach, who works with the team at times- His role, specialty- Working with the Pass Rushers to make them better- main target Gholston- but also the whole defensive unit. An example of his influence- he talked about Jenkins needing to use his hands and arms to rush the QB- remember that Texans Center he clubbed out of the way!
that was one of my biggest problems with mangini – the guy was set in stone on his base 3-4, and would never go away from it…even though it was obvious at times that he did not have the players to get the job done.
how frustrating was it to see dewayne robertson get blasted 4 yards off the line on every play? or last year when jenkins was out of the game, the same thing would happen to Pouha. even though it was obvious what we were doing wasnt working, mangini refused to change it up. it was this inability to make adjustments that was one of mangini’s weaknesses as a coach.
the vilma situation was affected by his injury – so i want to give mangini a partial pass there. but what i love about rex is his philosophy that seems to be “get me the best players, and i will find a role for them” there is no doubt that if vilma was still in green, rex would have him in one of the 46 packages, or playing a hybrid safety/LB position similar to eric smith’s role. my head is already spinning thinking about scott, harris and vilma all on the field together
Here’s a play with Gholston on defense.
I think he did his job here. He took up 2 blockers which should have allowed the LB’s to get the tackle but Johnson has too much speed and he just got loose for a big gain. However, look at how gets the tackle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y5hjGfB1bM
Lito Sheppard will start this weekend in Naw’lins. Courtesy of 1050 espn radio. Great news! Who knows maybe Strickland will be a game time decision now. I think that 4-0 isn’t out of reach. People in NO can say what they want, but they never seen a defense like this before. They can try and simulate all they want, but its nothing compared to the real thing. 1.8-2.0 seconds. Can Brees get the ball out of his hands in that time. And i’m predicting a few pick 6’s this week
I remember being at the playoff game in New England in January 2007. We had seats right behind the endzone about 15 yards off the field. The Jets D was backed up to the goal line, and I remember noticing how small the Jets D-line was as compared to the Patriots O-line. I remember seeing Jonathan Vilma coming in on a blitz and getting absolutely pancaked by two Patriots O-linemen who were free after having blasted Dewayne backwards approximately 15 yards. Screw The Penguin. Rex Ryan is the man.
well said, whenever Im watching one of the games this year and I decide to key on Vernon gholston for that play it seems like 80% of the time hes being blocked by 2 guys. Its curious because Gholston is in his second year and hasnt done much yet they keep double teaming him. He could be one of those guys where there just literally afraid to possibly allow him a free shot at the QB. Thats the only thing I can think of, but i certainly noticed the speed he has when he tracked down CJ from behind on that run.
Maybe teams double-teaming him is one of his biggest pluses, afterall, that has to free up space for Scott, Harris or, from next week on, Pace
i’m far from a gholston apologist but i do think that was a great play by him. one play doesn’t make a player but all we can ask for as fans is that VG goes 100% at all times. he went 100% on that play and definitely saved a touchdown.
Well said Jeff. Any NFL player playing full out is an impovement over a prima donna like Ownes in Buffalo or Moss in Oakland.
On Ronnie’s post- looking at the VG play- he was double teamed by OT and TE- I cant blame him for this good run by Johnson, it was great hustle down field to save a TD. The key to that play was WR 12 Justin Cage blocking Leonhard into Revis, causing Revis to fall on his butt and totally losing Outside Containment! Great blocking by Titans, I blame Revis for the play cause no one blocked him, his man WR Cage went to block Leonhard meaning it is Revis’ job to make the tackle and contain Johnson.
Great news that Lito will be starting!
Gholston has to find a way to shed that block and get to the ball career. When i see that play, i see a mane trying to get bye two guys without looking for the ball. If he sheds some blocks that play would not have gone for that many yards. Still good hustle though.
Search Chuck Smith on NewYorkJets.com
- audio- jets radio: 8/16/09- camp interview
Tried to post the link but they keep blocking it!
Great interview of Chuck Smith over summer training camp. Smith is a Guest Coach, who works with the team at times- His role, specialty- Working with the Pass Rushers to make them better- main target Gholston- but also the whole defensive unit. An example of his influence- he talked about Jenkins needing to use his hands and arms to rush the QB- remember that Texans Center he clubbed out of the way!
He wasn’t being double teamed per say….the run was going that way so they had extra blockers. It wasn’t that they were assigning two men to Gholston.
From my play-by-play analysis, this was actually one of the few times he was swallowed up at the line. On most of the other runs in his direction, he did a better job than this, so it’s interesting that we are pointing to this as one of his better plays.
But I do agree that Leonhard could have read the play better and kept contain, so Gholston taking on 2 blockers, disengaging and hustling back into the play is impressive in it’s own right.
It Would of taken a great play by VG to stop that run Zartan. CJ didnt commit to run outside til the last minute. VG used his hands well on the OT so he could go inside to slow down or tackle CJ if he chose inside; CJ recognized VG was positioned to the inside and ran to the outside, because he saw Cage was demolishing Leonhard- pushing Leanhard back, causing Cage to help seal VG inside, as well as Cage pushing Leanhard into Revis.
No matter how u look at, the key to that run was not VG inability at the line, it was Cage demolishing Leonhard, pushing Leonhard into Revis, causing Revis to fall on his butt, losing contaiment. The blame should be on Revis not VG. Some of u guys need to stop trying to blame everything on VG and look at who really is to blame- Revis on that Play.
If u look at the transcript from the Pettine interview, a few post below this one, Pettine states VG’s job a lot of the time is doing the dirty work, occupying blockers so the LB’s and DB’s can make the tackle. That is exactly what VG did on that play.
Yeah, the only thing you could say is that Gholston may have had more of a responsibility for outside containment, in which case he should have read the play better and made sure he positioned himself on the outside. If Johnson cut back, there should have been players there. I know Leonhard and Revis were also outside, but that’s only because Gage stayed in to block. If he ran a route, Revis would have gone with him, that’s why I put it on Leonhard, who I don’t want to unduly criticize because he has otherwise done really well.
Having said that, one of the guys who blocked VG was Crumpler, who was probably Leonhard’s assignment in the event of a pass, so he couldn’t leak outside until he was certain it was a running play.
Well designed play, good execution by the blockers and CJ, not perfect communication between the DBs and Gholston (if we’re nitpicking) perhaps a shade slow to read it. Getting back into the play though was definitely important.
PS – Don’t forget to join the chat:
http://www.chatzy.com/175711661922
Bassett:
I think an interesting article / blog post (or whatever you call them in the “Blogosphere” might be to analyze the interplay – and really the benefit of – having Rex Ryan replace Eric Mangini.
Everyone knows the main, justified knock on Mangini. He was a robot and made all of his players into robots. He generally wanted his defenders to sit back and read-and-react as a play develops, and he wanted to fit square pegs into round holes (like trying to make Gholston into an all-around OLB or handcuffing Kerry Rhodes – a playermaker – and essentially nullifying his ability in his conservative system).
Everyone knows why Rex’s defenses are successful: his aggressive blitzing packages put pressure on the QB, get sacks, mash up running plays in the backfield, and force mistakes by generating TONS of pressure.
However, even in Rex’s attack-oriented scheme, discipline is paramount. They obviously have a very comprehensive package of coverage schemes that accompanying their blitzing packages (making it seem like there are 15 players out there on defense; for example, see Matt Shaub’s throws into triple coverage when the JETS were blitzing 5-7 defenders).
I do think Mangini should be credited with instilling extreme discipline in his players (which, of course, rose to the level of a knock against him). He also forced them to learn a lot about various roles within a 3-4 defense (albeit with some players like Gholston it didn’t bear any positive results because he hasn’t thus far become anything remotely approaching a complete player). But despite the very real short-comings in Mangini’s “read-and-react” system, the system was built largely around doing EXACTLY what you are supposed to do on each play. One concern about the players in a Rex Ryan defense (I’m guessing, as I’ve never played for a Rex Ryan defense haha) is that players will become overly aggressive with the schemes and the new attitude, and will abandon assignments. I think Mangini’s tenure probably holds some positive residuary effects in the discipline category.
In addition, the talent assembled over the years FOR the purpose of fitting into Mangini’s 3-4 defensive scheme has fortuitously turned out to be quite an excellent fit for Rex Ryan’s attacking, aggressive defense. During Mangini’s tenure, Jenkins adjusted to being more of a true 3-4 NT, David Harris learned about the various roles of a 3-4 MLB at the NFL level, Bryan Thomas pretty much thrived (his haters probably will kill me on that point), and Sean Ellis became a quite competent 3-4 DE. Although he is no longer calling the shots as the “quarterback of the defense” (Jim Leonhard is), Kerry Rhodes was – obviously – forced to more comprehensively learn about everyone’s role within Mangini’s defense, where all the pieces must fit, etc. I think that this has through 3 games, and will continue to, enhance Kerry Rhodes’ ability now that he is assuming more of a play-making role in Rex’s defense, and being put in that position more often.
In summary, something that I think is lost on a lot of people, and something I haven’t seen written about, is the fact that it may very well be the case that a Mangini-to-Rex Ryan transition was perhaps a blessing to the organization. I don’t mean just dumping Mangini, but am trying to phrase it moreso as a credit to what Mangini left behind, and how it probably has helped turn this defense into a monster through 3 games under Rex Ryan.
As someone who was vociferously opposed to Gholston as a prospect coming out of OSU, I’ve been pleasantly surprised by how he’s worked within this defense. No, he’s not making tackles or big plays, but he’s absolutely doing a good job of controlling gaps and pushing the pocket. He’s been one of the more unsung reasons for the early defensive success (although that shouldn’t be overstated, as he’s rotated and not on the field a ton). I was reluctant to blame the coaching staff last year for Gholston’s struggles, as he looked a lot like the player I saw at OSU, but clearly he has taken steps under the new defensive staff. I still wouldn’t expect him to turn into a player worthy of the pick, but he’s improved significantly since the beginning of the preseason and he is now a working part in the defense rather than a disaster.
“well said, whenever Im watching one of the games this year and I decide to key on Vernon gholston for that play it seems like 80% of the time hes being blocked by 2 guys. Its curious because Gholston is in his second year and hasnt done much yet they keep double teaming him. ”
Well of some plays when Jets D are overloading a side the opponent has 2 O-lonieman not doing jack because they have no one to block. VG can simply be Rex’s decoy on that side who is responsible for closing the edge.
DSmizzle is actually Mangini. Notice how you’ve never seen them in the same room together?
As many have already said, it’s great to have a HC and staff who aren’t trying to “fit square pegs in round holes” ala Mangini.
Speaking of our former HC, during the off and pre-seasons there were a few here both defending his tenure and predicting success for him in Cleveland.
Now it seems his defenders have disappeared.
I can’t say I wonder why.
Its comes down to the same problem as always with VG… Until he learns how to get to the QB with something other than a bullrush and his speed…( both which have not worked so far) he will never be a vaulable player for us.
Yes he is getting better but he was barely dressing last year. I wanted to guy even though I though he was limited in college.
I am happy to see him show up from time to time but he is getting paid to make plays…and not just the random hustle ones
I thought Mangini would have been better served as a DC for a year or so and then get another shot. I think everyone (even his supporters) were shocked to see him get the Cleveland job
I am actually suprised this post didnt have a picture ot Gholston’s yolked up arms while not making a play.
“spentmiles, on October 2nd, 2009 at 1:17 pm Said:
DSmizzle is actually Mangini. Notice how you’ve never seen them in the same room together?”
Haha, you got me. I figured the hip, cool, “izzle” in the name would have thrown you all off and convinced you that I am not, in fact, Eric Mangina.
Great 2 hear that lito will start on Sunday!! Does any1 know how legit that report was?
Anywayz, mayb vernon will have a big game this Sunday against that aints! Rex shuld line him up on the left to go against that second or third string lt! Vernon could get a sack or 2…go JETS!
DSmizzle,
I think them main knock on Mangini wasn’t just turning the players into robots, but being a robot himself. Just as he didn’t adjust his schemes to fit his players, he didn’t adjust his schemes to fit his opponents, game situations, or game conditions.
It seemed as if the entirety of his coaching decisions were both made in a vacuum and set in stone. From the outside it seemed as if his ego was the final arbiter of all his decisions.
i dont know who said lito is playing this week but i just saw rex’s press conference and he said sheppard and strickland are definately out saying it wouldnt be fair to them to play them them being that they havent practiced in 2 weeks. hopefully pace sheppard and stricland will ne available next week for miami
Youngjet…was this press conference from today or from Wednesday? Can somebody plz confirm if lito will star or sit on Sunday?
“The blame should be on Revis not VG. Some of u guys need to stop trying to blame everything on VG and look at who really is to blame- Revis on that Play.”
I obviously don’t know details about the scheme they were playing on that particular play, but it is highly unlikely that the CB would have primary contain responsibility. What if the WR ran a go route instead of stalk blocking? There would be no containment. In that alignment, the DE (Gholston) would traditionally have primary contain responsibilty. Looks like Johnson made a nice move to lean inside and cut outside, giving the blocker a chance to get to Gholston’s outside shoulder. Give Johnson and Crumpler credit, but Gholston has got to get outside because the MLB has the inside cut back lane. BUT he still made a great hustle play and should be commended for that. I think he’s coming around.
Revis did get blocked, which turned a good run into a big play. But he wasn’t primarily at fault.
Any confirmation on Lito starting? I just saw on Francesa’s show that he and Strick are both out.
@ m eazi
the conference was from today
The big ?s around VG has never been his physical abilities but his heart, passion and football IQ. The great thing about his season thus far is that he has shown he has the drive to get better and play with desire.
both lito and strickland are listed as out according to WFAN
Bogus game ball, but I like Rex trying to help VG’s fragile psyche.
gotta hand it to Vernon. he did save a touchdown
Led- Cage from the start went over to block Leonhard- leaving Revis as the DB that is unblocked- revis went inside just like VG because that was Chris Johnsons first move, but then CJ bounced outside and no one was one revis- Leonhard got pushed back hard by Cage and Revis wound up tripping over leonhard and falling to the ground. The bottom line is that there was no one on one blocker on Revis- it was his play to make, to prevent the big run and he didnt make the play. Everyone else was being blocked- VG first chipped by OT and then picked by TE- Crumpler, Scott picked excellently by the OT that started off on VG, Leonhard Dominated by #12 WR Justin Cage. No one blocked revis! Initial containment should be by VG, would agree, but in the second level 9 times out of 10 Revis would of made the tackle to save the long run. This time he got tripped, Titans had a great blocking scheme, but in my eyes Revis is the one to Blame cause he was UNBLOCKED the whole time!
VG is still a kid when he starts to feel like a man, which we are all witnessing, he will be fine.
He needs to feel like he is a man and he belongs not just look like it.
RKNYC,
I totally agree. Fans have to have patience. If Ryan and Pettine continue to groom VG — when we get to the playoffs, he might surprise our opponents (and some of our fans).
Gholston is getting a little better each week, but, he still looks very stiff, has trouble shedding blocks and his #1 problem is he plays with NO heart or passion. He doesn’t have a killer instinct ….. hopefully Rex can get a fire going in VG