Shonn Greene’s Offseason Checklist: Hold the Ball!
The Post notes that the Jets rookie runner has been causing the Jets some concern on his penchant to fumble the ball.
Rookie RB Shonn Greene is beginning to become a ball protection problem. Greene, who has 71 carries this season, lost his third fumble when he was stripped in the third quarter at the end of a 25-yard gain.
Hands have been a concern for Greene since arriving. He admitted back during the rookie minicamps that he wasn’t a good ballcatcher and while catching a football and holding a football aren’t the same, there’s clearly a connection. We wrote about Greene’s fumbling woes last week, a common occurrence for some hard-nosed young runners in the NFL. What matters is how they adjust their game in coming years. Tiki was a notrious fumbler. In his first year of workhorse play, Brandon Jacobs struggled to hold the ball, even Thomas Jones bounced around the league until he could hold onto the ball.
What we noted was a 3% rate of fumbling for Greene so far, in comparison, Thomas Jones currently has a fumble rate of under 1%. With Greene’s carries yesterday, that stat (albeit a small sample) moved to 4%. At that rate with 250 carries on a season would project to 10 fumbles. Not good for him or the team longer-term. This coming offseason, the Jets and Greene need to do some serious work to clean up those lost fumbles.
Can I suggest starting with watching The Program, and taking a page from Darnell Jefferson, Shonn?
41 Responses to Shonn Greene’s Offseason Checklist: Hold the Ball!
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brian311 says:
i agree this is a problem, but this play was a little bit of a fluke. he was stumbling down and ronde barber came from behind and knocked the ball out. sometimes you have to tip your cap to the defensive player for making a play
what is concerning to me is that because if greens fumbling problem, TJ continuned to be in a meaningless game in the 4th quarter. i know they wanted to get him to 100 yards, but he should not have been playing in garbage time. if the coaching staff had more faith in green, we could keep TJ fresh
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Harris52ChampionshipDefense says:
Ha, nice reference Bassett.
“Darnell Jefferson, tailback.”
“Ray Griffen, starting tailback.”
“I know, that’s why I’m here.” -
John Z says:
Fumbles are a rookie issue the same way INTs are for rookie QBs. A good indication of the quality of the coaching staff is how he adjusts next season.
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greg sec 130 says:
Jones is actually at .76%, when not rounded up.
Another thing: Thomas Jones fumbles to fumbles lost = 0% (2 fumbles, 0 lost), while Greene’s is 100% (3 fumbles, 3 lost), which can in part be attributed to a verteran’s ability to keep the ball close and lose the ball on the way down, while Greene’s fumbles have been popped out and jumped around more.
That said, looking at Jones stats to see this, I noticed he fumbled 3x in 112 carries his first year, and 11 times in his first four years (499 carries).
Is this a youth thing (I think so), and how much can be attributed to part-time duty, or a combination of both, where a young back tries to do too much in his limited time.
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What sucks is he is really running the ball well and there have been games when he is pounding it better than TJ……yesterday was one of those games.
Yesterday’s was more of a fluke as grizzled vet Ronde punched it out when Greene was bracing himself after stumbling…..but he needs to understand thats what defenders do in the NFL.
He will get better at this. he didnt fumble alot at Iowa. Alot of young RB’s are a little careless.
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Shamik says:
If this is all we have to worry about with Shonn Greene, I think we’re in pretty good shape in terms of the running game next year. Man, think of how great we could be if we had our own version of Earth Wind and Fire!
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Green Lantern says:
A lot of Rookie runners have ball security issues. Adrian Peterson the best Running Back in the league still has fumbling issues.
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dmazz says:
Yeah looking back – I’m glad we spent that draft pick on Greene and not Miles Austin.
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Brendan says:
If you go by his college stats, fumbles shouldn’t be an issue over the long haul. Just like any other skill, defensive players can learn to strip it much better than college players, so Shonn has to improve his ball carrying abilities. Not too tough.
But anyone who is saying this was a fluke fumble is fooling themselves. I saw that fumble coming 15 yards away with Ronde gaining ground hard and Greene not putting the ball in the right arm (closest to the sideline, Shonn!). Either way, these are things that can be corrected, and as someone said, if this is our biggest issue with him, we’ll be ok.
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Shonn Greene Is doing great besides the fumbling . Im kind of disappointed though CJ Spiller would be niceeee!!
Yes I am finding something to complain about haha. -
Dylan says:
John Z is right. Look at the rookie running backs. Knowshon has 4 fumbles, Beanie has 3, McCoy has 2, Brown has 1, and Goodson has 1 (on only 4 carries). Its nothing to worry about.
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Jets-Fan-4-Life says:
This is just another reason why the Jets should not let Thomas Jones walk after this season!
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dmazz,
We got Greene in the 3rd round. Austin would’ve costed us a 2nd rounder. So basically, we got Sanchez instead of getting Austin (over-simplified, but you get the idea).
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I know we traded for Edwards but at the end of the season how about we go after Brandon Marshall before we jump back on the Edwards train. Braylon has been great but Brandon has better hands and he has better hands than Edwards.
Worst Case Scenario is we dont sign Marshall but we immediately sign Edwards back. -
EQ1217 says:
All rookies (Sanchez, Greene) tend to do more than they are capable of and that’s when turnovers occur.
Like some people said above, if Greene’s fumbling all over the place next year, then we might have a problem and really the same goes for Sanchez.
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SackDance99 says:
Green Lantern,
The price for Marshall will be ginormous and Cutler will be placing massive amounts of pressure on the Bears management to do whatever it takes to sign Marshall. Edwards might be pricey, too. But, Marshall’s contract may make him the NFL’s highest paid player.
As for Greene, rookie RBs fumble. They have to learn not to. Greene’s talent and second-level ability is something the Jets need in games. I hope that he doesn’t get into Rex’s doghouse, because I’d like to see him get more carries.
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clint says:
Well if it helps any. Josh Freeman fumbles 18 percent of the time.
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Brendan
When I say fluke I mean that he was stumbling and a Hall of Fame CB was closing on him. To say he should have changed from right to left is a little picky. Players would usually change when near the sidelines. Greene was basically in the middle of the field and just catching his balance.
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And, while we have TJ, Greene won’t be getting a whole lot of carries in spots where ball security is more important. Code red = TJ
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Biebs says:
It’s a shame the Jets don’t play the Steelers this year. Greene could talked to Jefferson after the game, you know, now that’s the head coach of the Steelers.
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LifeLongJetsFan86 says:
Did Shonn hold some kind of record in college for NOT fumbling??? Or am I mistaken?
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Drew,
It’s not picky at all. From the time you are 8 years old, you’re taught to move the ball to the outside arm. There are many reasons, but the most important are: it puts your body between the ball and the pursuing defenders, and if you fumble it will most likely head towards the sideline. He was at the left hash when he fumbled, which indicates he should have been carrying it in his left arm.
And I’m not buying the “stumbling and HOF CB” argument, either. How many times do you think Greene has been tackled in his life? I’m willing to bet enough to know that people are always going for the ball. He’s a bowling ball who isn’t scared of contact, so he shouldn’t be worried about falling down. Protect the ball at all times. Ronde did a godo job of not giving up, but when you’re running ahead of the pack (pay attention, Braylon) you ALWAYS protect the ball just before contact. Defenders are taught to always punch the ball from behind, it’s how fumbles are most often created.
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lifelongjetsfan86,
Not sure if it was a record, but he never fumbled during his college career (376 carries, 11 receptions,
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I hope he can fix this sooner rather than later, and isn’t stuck in the doghouse. I’m impressed with his explosiveness, and how quick he is once he gets to the hole and how hard it seems to be to bring him down.
I love TJ, but there are a lot of “3 yards and fall over at first contact” carries for him — yesterday included. Greene doesn’t seem to go down to the first tackler, and has shown a nice ability to get yards and into the second level, even when facing stacked lines, like yesterday.
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BigKatFan says:
dont worry about it. I remember a certain rookie who used to fumble a lot. (cough, LEON, cough)
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Vinny "IcantPASSthe" TESTAVERDE says:
I would never fumble the ball.
Put me back in the line up -
Brendan
He was catching his balance after running thru an arm tackle. Yes….. he should secured the ball better but to say he should have switched the ball at that moment is being picky.
You dont have to buy the HOF theory….The fact is Ronde Barber made a great play….
Not sure why this is a continued discussion…. We disagree on the changing the ball theory for this play. I feel at that moment he couldnt and it wasnt a big deal that he didnt. We both think he doesnt have a fumbling problem and he will be a big time back.
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dave b says:
I noticed a comparison to Tiki Barber
I remember in his last season he devoted time to learning how to hold the ball differently and his fumbling # dropped dramatically.
Fumbling is something, in my opinion, that’s more remediable than other RB woes, so if he’s going to have a deficiency, this is a ‘good’ one to work on, as compared with poor instincts, strength, leverage, etc..
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… recognizing, as Drew points out, sometimes a good defensive play trumps form
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Agreed that these issues can be corrected. But when you have 3 fumbles all taken from you it tends to make them look less and less fluke like. That was my point. He also hit the open field and ran cleanly for 20 yards where he could have switched the ball. He’ll be drilled with that information I’m sure and will make his #1 priority securing the football.
That fumble doesn’t occur if he has the ball in his other arm. It’s pretty simple. There’s especially no excuse for someone low and compact like Greene is. But again, I’m very confident this will not be a long-lasting issue. He’ll figure it out he’s still a young guy and not used to having people attack the ball on every tackle.
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BTW, I know this is not the space for this. But after talking to all my dejected, Giants fan friends (all 9 million of them) there was not a single person who answered “no” when I asked them if they’d take Kerry Rhodes right now. That gives you an idea of how he is received around the league outside of Jets circles. Although, after watching the Gmen get torched on deep balls all game, I bet they would take Damien Robinson (he of Kyle Turley-related fame) back there.
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Just a couple of other guys who played well….
How about Brad Smith? Played pretty well and I will try not to jinx him but J Feely has been lights out since we picked him up last year. I wish he wouls stay back on these KO coverages tho. The guy is up at the 30 trying to make tackles every KO.
In agreement with Brendan on Kerry. I think most Jet fans are harder on him cause they remember 2006-2007. It was great to hear Ian Eagle and R Gannon praise Revis for film study and hard work….. but tough when they talked about the demise of Kerry Rhodes and where his game has gone.
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Damien Robinson also of having a ton of semi automatic assault rifles in the back of his car….lol
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m eazii says:
Greene is a beast, he will fix the fumbling problem, I am sure the coaching staff will get him 2 understand that it is important to protect the ball when running with it in the nfl, something braylon needs to work on also, imo….but I give credit to ronde barber on that play, he just made a play on the ball, yea shonn could have switched it over to his left arm but as someone mentioned, he was stumbling and was trying to regain his balance with his left arm at that moment, so I would have to say you can’t really bash shonn on this 1
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And as far as the rhodes talk, he is gaining his starting job little by little, although e smith is coming around…I like that defensvie package where rex has rhodes roaming the center of the field and e mith and leonard are by the line of scrimmage covering rbs and tes and stuffing the run!
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When L.T was a rookie he fumbled 8 times, of course he only fumbled 2.35% of time. It still shows it can be worked on.
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Sideliner says:
Didn’t see the game out here in AZ. I saw the stats and was wondering how Woodhead looked? They seem to be uing him more on 3rd down. Is there anything there to get excited about?
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Joe B. says:
I’m high as a kite on this dude. He looks like a stud in the making, and so far his fumbling is the only cause for concern. Considering how his fumbles have been created, I don’t think it’s much of an issue. All three of them have happened when he’s trying to fight for more yards even though he probably should’ve gone down already. That’s a rookie trying to do too much, very similar to the issue that’s plagued Sanchez thus far. Knowshon Moreno also had fumbling problems earlier this year and he’s going to be a solid back too.
I’m confident that Sanchez and The LocomoShonn will become better protectors of the ball with more experience and I’m very excited for the future with them. SG looks like another late-round steal by Tanny, and as much as I love TJ, Shonn’s progress will make it much easier to eventually part ways with him.
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EpidemikE says:
@LifeLongJetsFan86
You’re right about Shonn’s personal record of never fumbling during his college career. I personally think that he just needs some time to adjust to the game.
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Eddie DiGio says:
Joe B- LocoMoShonn….Amazing LoL
Kid has to learn the same way Chez has to learn. They were so much better than everyone else in college, they take the little things, like carrying the ball in the proper hand, for granted. Kid has a burst, vision and the ability to fall and maneuver foward for positive yardage. A little extra time with Anthony Lynn and the case of fumble-itis to clear right up
No reason to worry. I’m confident he’ll adjust.